Reign of Gaming

Seeing trinity force or wits end on shen wasn't uncommon even in tournaments.
I remember when I started playing league of legends, and during then every bruiser did pretty much build wargmog and atma. They did stack heath even then. 
Now that I think more of it. Building health is pretty much of definition of a bruiser. Otherwise they would just be normal ad melee carry (like tryndamere). Building resistances is more tank like than building health.

If you are going to use argument that:
Shen has taunt, therefore he is a tank. 
We could also claim that ahri is a tank too with that logic. 

Beside saying that sunfire cape is a tank item than a bruiser item is just wrong. Sunfire cape gives you damage and hp. Which goes well with definition of bruiser items.

Sej was probably Riot being afraid of making Amumu 2.0 with a big slow attached. In reality that threat never materialized.

Naut got that pretty much so that other junglers could kick him around. He could stand to lose it now that the jungle can kick people around.

Cho has the magic of free HP. That's why he's always been hard to get rid of if he's taken the time to stack Feast. It's a very non-trivial amount too, at level 16 a full stack of Feasts is worth 900 HP. On its own.

Base values are important, but there's more to it.

Something needs to be made to separate a "bruiser" build from a "tank" build, since at the moment bruisers can do A LOT of damage at the cost of very little durability compared to full tanks. I think the old atmogs meta was pretty nice actually, since it encouraged bruisers to forego some tankiness in order to get both offensive and defensive scaling. Perhaps buff atmas a bit, and nerf base damage values on health bruisers, forcing them to go into some damage rather than just stacking health would be best. Trinity bruisers already have this, but with the introduction of iceborn gaultlet less so. Also, give tanks some sort of "tank-rabadon", ie multiplicative scaling on defensive items, to truly set them apart from bruisers in terms of tankiness. Maybe randuin could fill this spot, with some tweaks to it's number to be less beneficial at low resistance levels.

I can play as any role in this game, but my favorites are tanks and support. So you might say I'm bias, but in my experience tanking has become much harder than before. Try build full tank and try to initiated a battle. I can promise that you will die pretty fast. Reason why I build my tanks to bruisers now. Because at least I can do something useful in game then.
There were days when tanks didn't do much damage, but they were able to take many hits. As fed it was possible to survive 1v5. I repeat SURVIVE, not win. Now you can barely survive even 1-2 guys.

For some reason people think that jax, olaf, and garen are tanks. Which isn't true at all. Yes they can initiated, but I wouldn't call them tanks in any sense.

More interesting is that they say that tanks are still viable. Which is true in a sense. Tank champions are viable, but it isn't viable to build them as tanks any more. Which was pretty much point of hashinshin's post. For some reason I think people are more butthurt for hashinshin to show his opinion than hashinshin is to tank nerfs.

"I'm not saying ALL %HEALTH DAMAGE IS OP AND CLEARLY NERFNERFNERF. I never say that about anything. YOU people say that. Generalizing is the key to stupidity."

I liked that one. "WE people" / "YOU idiots that read my articles"..?

Anyway that's a bad generalization bro, I never said that..never heard anyone say it either - except you: "...ALL %HEALTH DAMAGE IS OP AND CLEARLY NERFNERFNERF. I ne..."

Ha. Ha. Another Hashinshin rage post. 

Emo?

Plenty in this article that I could disagree with - but especially the part about nerfing tanks further. My instinct tells me that we will see tanks going back to being valid choices, with Health early game helping them while late game resistances join to round out their items. And as for all those sources of damage that they can't handle anymore?

The damage champs dish out is going to get nerfed. Except % Health, which will remain as a counter, and will give reason for tanks to transition from Health stacking to resistances sooner if enemies pursue that path. Once Riot fine tunes the numbers on this, all will be well again. Nothing to worry about.

Tanks are doing just fine, Shen, Amumu, Chogath, and Olaf were high priority picks all throughout LCS this weekend. Infact Olaf was picked or banned roughly 100% of the time and always built tanky, the Olaf build of Shurelya's, Warmogs, and Sunfire was so standard you could predict the purchases on every back. So people building tanky are obviously not doomed to failure by %HP.

As for %HP itself, Liandry's is a noob trap item on almost everyone that builds it right now. If you are a poke caster like teemo you can get some use out of Liandry's 5% Current HP. If you're a burst caster though Liandry's %HP does nothing for you. It works just like a Teemo shroom where the dot is refreshed instead of stacked, so if you run in and go "QWER!" and run out that 5% is 5% of what was left over. So if you do a 3.5k burst to a 4k hp target Liandrys will tick for 5% of the remaining 500hp, it's honestly nothing to write home about.

Chogath and Olaf aren't tanks. Especially Olaf, Olaf is a bruiser that people build tanky (like pretty much everything these days, even casters like Elise). How much CC does Olaf have? 1 slow. Can he peel? No. Olaf also has huge damage even if built tanky, which is different than actual tanks. 

All you see of tanks is Shen because he can split push and Amumu, because he can jungle well and is a great initiator and can gank well and Maokai, because he can jungle and gank.

The problem with tanks is that they are mostly unplayable in lane, potentially only playable on bot, where they get no money and become irrelevant late game, because unlike supports, they need money.
So the only way to play tanks is as a jungler. And if a tank is a poor jungler or doesn't have rock solid ganks then it's useless and it's not getting played EVER. Alistar, nautilus, galio, rammus, sejuani, volibear. Never see them. Thresh is also listed as a tank, though that's the biggest fucking joke ever (also I've never seen thresh played 2 days after the release - but that's another topic)

Why would you pick a champion like rammus who can only be played as a jungler and even that not that well, and does fuck-all damage late game, instead of a bruiser who can be played in lane or jungle, can be built tanky and still do damage, like olaf, renekton, nasus?

Olaf is a bruiser who people build tanky? That's what everyone is. He compensates for no peeling by being able to destroy the enemy carry. Shen also has great damage, less than olaf but more peel,initiation and support, and more innate tankiness. Mao kai is the king of peeling, amumu is the best Teamfight coordinator with great peel and destructive damage.

What's so bad with most tanks being only viable on jungle? Maybe that could need a bit fixing but it's not enough to make someone rage over it.

Because Rammus has amazing damage output in a teamfight, great ganks,initiation, THE GODLIEST PEEL EVER and huge innate resistances WITH damage reflection.

Did you even watch the latest match where they used rammus? They did build him full tank and he was still killed in a split second when he tried to initiated a fight. Building a tank isn't viable any more. Building a bruiser or a ap bruiser is viable.

What the fuck did I just read. It was so confusing and most of it pointless, all I got out of it was "Butthurt, butthurt wah wah riot balance the game how I like it butthurt ranting".

I personally love playing cc tanks and tank oriented bruisers, and have not found season 3 to have affected them negatively as a whole. In fact, some of them were severely buffed by the changes. For example Garen's w passive, in a world of limited armour and MR, gets a huge buff, because it makes his resistance items much more efficient than when others buy them. Cho gets a similar relative buff, because when he builds resistances, his free health makes them worth more. 

Does Liandry's hurt tanks who stack HP? Yes, it does, but you know what that's better than? Having absolutely no counterplay for mages except for "Get more AP" or "Be a tanky mage with sustained dps". And honestly, tanks can take advantage of it too, as many AP tanks absolutely love the damage passive on it, often using it as their only damage item. The same applies to penetration, as Ad tanks can now build BC as a single damage item, causing them to do respectable damage while still building for the team. 

You complain about not being able to build true tank anymore, but that, to me, is just stupid. If you want to deal damage, you should have to build some damage. If you only buy defensive items, you should be able to soak up a lot, but not deal much, as opposed to what happened in season 2, where tanks would be able to just build defensive, maybe with a trinity, and let their base values just tear people apart. 

First of all, Garen isn't a tank and he did that last season with the change to greater effect because resistancies were cheaper. Second of all, Cho'gath already did that last season, and possibly to greater effect (because health was harder to get or more expensive).

Your logic is as sound as a wet carboard box. If their base values were the problem, then those should've been nerfed. The punishment for building tanky should always be no damage and the punishment for building damage should always be no surviveability.

Building tanky and building damage should optimally always be tradeoffs one to another.

Holy crap, if his logic is as sound as a cardboard box, then yours needs to be dried off as well, you essentially agreed with everything he said, but stated his thoughts were flawed.

"If you only buy defensive items, you should be able to soak up a lot, but not deal much," (Subjugglator) = "The punishment for building tanky should always be no damage and the punishment for building damage should always be no surviveability." (You). You guys are saying the exact same thing.

The problem with nerfing base values is you destroy their later viability.  How many times has the community seen a nerf and thought "oh well that champ is useless".  You can't nerf ALL their numbers.  Just outright nerfing something isn't always the solution. What we are seeing right now about tanks not surviving with just resistances is an example of "nerfing" tanks without touching all their base numbers.

Also, Subjugglator was stating that Garen and Cho essentially do the same thing they did last season, but are better off this season because of the changes.  He was not saying that people changed the way they build them this season compared to last like you believe.  If anything he's correct in thinking that.  Garen and Cho are inadvertenly  buffed because they essentially can get more bang for their buck now that resistances are more expensive and less effective.  Essentially they remained the same while everyone else got nerfed, hence a "buff".