This title is somewhat of a misnomer but I'll go in to why I titled it like that later. Basically we're all no longer playing league to play league, we are all playing league in order to abuse the latest most OP trend until it gets fixed. Late Season 2 had huge issues with imba-as-fuck champions, and Season 3 has that issue + item issues. Lulu, Jayce, Rengar, Elise, etc. BC, Warmogs, BotRK, etc. We're in an age right now where our balance isn't about finding a champion you're good at and playing them to win, it's about finding the most OP thing and abusing it until its nerfed. Of course after its nerfed Riot will have put in a newer even more OP thing to deal with.
Video helps! But I still suck at this whole "speaking thing." Video goes on and I forget what is do englisch.
We aren't playing to win anymore, we're playing to get as far as we can until things are patched and we have to deal with the next issue.
It has gotten worse. Notably. Yes we always had balance issues but it's never was really so bad as it was now. The only time I can think of that it was nearly as bad as it is now is when the tanky damage bruiser Season 1 meta was around. And that was caused both by buffs to and new tank items, nerfs to AD items, and tons of new OP bruisers to abuse. There's really no excuse for this terrible balance 2-3 years later when we already know all these issues. I mean lets go in to detail.
BC with a day of testing should have revealed it was WTF level. Is Riot even testing anymore? I have no idea. I don't test for Riot, I just look at their results. And their results lately blow. Hard. BC comes out despite the fact that any sane person could have found out it was OP in 5 seconds of testing. I can't put enough emphasis on this. We the players can only speculate on items, we can only say "well based on these stats that I see..." it's up to Riot to PLAY with it and say "holy motherfucker, did you see this shit?" But they didn't, because apparently they didn't test it or simply didn't care.
But okay, one screw up is fine, it slipped through.
But then how do you explain the tank items? Sunfire went DOWN in cost losing no stats despite being one of the more picked and powerful items in Season 2. Sunfire had nowhere to go but down, and they moved it up in power? But you know, two mistakes so whatever. Then how do you explain warmogs? Warmogs got more scaling, lost the creep farming part, and went down in cost by 330. (I should note new Warmogs is less efficient than old Warmogs and is actually on its way out, since Riot saw fit to overnerf it, but that's for later.) Locket of the Iron Solari is insanity and bought on practically everyone but riot refuses to touch it?
Just how far behind is Riot's balance team?
Riot has the time to overnerf Warmogs, but not the item that is replacing Warmogs? How far behind are they? Warmogs was being replaced by Solari WEEKS before they nerfed it. This to me spells out precisely the problem: They aren't keeping up anymore. Where as in the past Riot would stall out nerfing something (perhaps for too long) just to see if it REALLY was OP in Season 3 Riot is rapid firing nerfs at anything that moves. The worst part is that most of their nerfs seem to be aimed at incredibly low ELO problems. Darius? Garen? Warmogs? These were a non issue for real balance and yet they're getting attention before the actual issues are being addressed.
And really a lot of these things they're nerfing and changing never even had time to properly be adjusted for. Warmogs was actually factually on its way out. Solari + sunfire was way better, and Warmogs was turning in to more of a late game item. Tristana and BotRK were being bought together because they worked so well. HP stacking really wasn't an issue for anyone that built properly, and again Warmogs was on its way out already.
That's where a lot of these issues are coming from, nerf/buff first let trickle later.
Warmogs was being replaced after the first nerf, it was still a decent item but it was no longer a first buy or must buy. It was going to trickle down to the lower ranks but Riot decided to slash away at it before seeing that. BotRK was a good niche item that people were starting to pick up on on champions it was good for. Riot massively overbuffed it to god tier before even most high ELO could pick up on it. Then we've got buffs to Tristana, buffs to Vayne, champions that are already being picked and used who are now buffed. Da fuq?
Now it's not all bad, sometimes it works.
Obviously the fallout from the hasty decisions is nastier than the good parts, but the good parts still exist. Volibear is playable now, Nasus is playable now, more items are viable now, etc. It's just that this could all be accomplished without dart board style balancing. That's really not the point though. Balancing a game played by millions shouldn't be a "well sometimes it works" process. Additionally, with a million players there is going to be enough experimenting and stat collecting that stuff will change drastically over time. Lets say it wasn't high ELO that find out XYZ is OP, lets say it was low ELO. When Jax +flat AD runes got really popular it was actually from mid ELO and it tricked UP that time.
But I really have to say that that's really all it feels like lately. Someone finds something "OP", it quickly gets nerfed, and nothing is ever learned on how to beat it.
We're abusing OP things with no attempt to learn to beat them.
That's what this really comes down to. We're nerfing and buffing so fast that things that appear to be OP we are just accepting as OP and abusing them till they get nerfed. It's a two part problem. A. Things are so OP that we can just abuse them on a patch-by-patch basis, and B. We never learn to properly combat said OP things and so it tends to get overnerfed because even when balanced we're just saying to ourselves "clearly OP, can't beat, wait till the nerf."
With that in mind we're also buffing things way too quickly because nobody is bothering to learn them either. My biggest example is still Tristana, but others exist as well. Sunfire rushing was gaining a HUGE amount of popularity at the end of Season 2 yet wasn't trickling down fast enough, so it got buffed in Season 3. BT was starting to become rushed on everyone and their mother at the end of Season 2, yet no trickling so buffy buffy (And later nerfy nerfy.) We're moving far too quickly for anyone to adjust, and as a result nothing is really changing, we're just OP chasers.
So I guess that's the end result here.
The point of the article, the end result, it's right there. Riot is strangling players like a playground bully going "you'll use my items on the champions I want you to use them on, and you'll use the champions I want god damnit!" Someone is like "so I wanted to play Jax top-" and Riot chokeslams them and says "YOU'LL PLAY ELISE GOD DAMNIT, AND YOU'LL USE LIANDRY'S!" It's really damaging the game. It's not good for anyone for Riot to be this much of a control freak right now. So, yeah. I don't know what can be done to stop it since Riot chokeslams anyone who moves outside their system since they'll be up against such OP odds. "I think I'll play Yi top since-" "NEVER, BOTRK IS NOT INSANELY OP AND XIN IS GOING TO FULL HP COMBO YOU!"
So please Riot, settle down. Get a grip. People are going to adjust to things if you let them, you just need to let them. You can't do such a drastic system revision as Season 3 was then turn around and glare at anyone not playing the game the way you want it to be played. What if I DIDN'T want to play the counter the counter minigame? What if I just wanted to stack AD or AP normally? You tackle me to the ground rand you say "but we made Liandry's and BotRK so OP, you basically HAVE to use them!" It's just boring now OP chasing.
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Posted 3/25/2013 9:38:33 PMThis happens in tournaments a lot. Just use the OP champ/ item to win. I think this is a bad thing. It doesn't really show skill when you abuse the OP things.
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Posted 3/24/2013 10:18:59 PMI think its entirely the image that the LCS gives them. All the pros have a pool of 20 champions that are picked or banned between them and to make sure the LCS stays pretty Riot only cares about those champions and the 18 different items each team uses. Then people take these High tier strategies and trickle them down to unsuspecting unexperienced lower tier players AND BOOM... chaos
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Posted 3/12/2013 12:37:55 PMThat indeed is a huge problem ATM - but i think it will solve itself in time.
What is happening here, right now, is RIOT trying to cope with LCS, while at the same time still trying to balance the leftover problems of the huge overhaul of Season 3.
New things are found out nearly on a daily basis, and most of that has to be patched as fast as possible, because its potentially abusable in their Tournament. Problem is, even though they have experience in balancing, and should be able to do better, its still a new situation for them. RIOT is simply not used to having to cope with things this fast, and they are trying their best to solve an uncertain equation that keeps changing on a pretty fast pace.
In my opinion they will realize themselves that they can't, and its not even necessary for them to, keep up with the tournament - all they need to do, is wait out what is really strong, and stop judging the book by its cover. They only need to address the things that are being abused in the tournament, instead of trying to predict what might be.
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Posted 3/6/2013 2:23:58 PMIsn't the whole point of gaming and building is to find the most powerful set of items and skills(champions) to have your power over the opposition If you don't take the chance to use something that works and is powerful than you are as good as conceding the match. All is fair in Love and War. and Love to make war in our games
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Posted 3/6/2013 4:36:34 PMI would up vote this if I could. I tried to say exactly the same thing earlier in the thread.
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Posted 3/6/2013 11:44:45 PMNo because there are some people (actually a lot of them) who plays with a champion because they love it, it doesnt matter if the champion is good or bad, your not playing an OP champ just because its OP if you hate that champion (be it for its lore, its design or w/e).
Its a matter of playstyle, some people play to win (we all do to some degree), and the champion itself doesn't matter if you like him or not, because for these people having fun means winning the game. But on the other hand, for some people, enjoying the champion you are using is so much part of the fun as actually winning a single game. And actually these people are the ones who can play better a specific champion, cause they will just play it non stop, even if its Karma or Heimer.
Also if you love a considered bad champion, you always have a real challenge at hands, your team depends on you, so you have to find a good build to minimize the weaknesses of your champ, and thats part of the fun, its da real challenge winning with a bad champion, and some people have more fun that way, every one is different. Also when you lane against an OP champ and actually win your lane (even more if its a good player), all your hard work and love pays off.
So there's much more out there in the game than playing OP stuff
Actually, abusing OP stuff should be a pro players thing mostly, cause its your job to win and get money, its a responsibility for them, so they cant risk playing champs they like if they are not viable. otherwise we common players are just playing to have fun. So have fun your way.
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Posted 3/7/2013 12:57:17 AMWell, I concede that not everyone plays this game to win. Some people just love the pretty colours etc., but I feel that you should also concede that for some people winning is the very definition of fun. That's how they enjoy the game... That's why they keep on playing it and this is, more often than not, what drives the competitive scene. So, be it theory crafting or experimentation, looking for and exploiting 'OP' champions or items/builds is very much integral to the game and endemic to the competitive community.
P.s. Sorry if I came off overly dismissive of the just playing for 'fun' crowd, but, well actually I am not that sorry :P
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Posted 3/7/2013 1:25:58 AMThere is also the point that some people just don't "get" a character. For example, Shen may be OP, but there will always be people who just aren't good at Shen (and it isn't a matter of being unskilled), and would prefer to play something else. You could force yourself to become skilled with a character you don't like, but why bother when there is another character who's moveset just feels "right" to you? Even pro players have favourites, and that is why Anivia is always banned against EG, and also the reason why not many other players play Anivia often. Because Froggen just found her moveset to fit his style, and no other AP character, regardless of how OP, will fit his playstyle as much as she does.
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Posted 3/7/2013 2:22:17 PMya true. I mostly just build the way I want too the way that works best for me. I rarely built warmogs(even when it was "OP") unless my champ scaled off health and it fit the build that works best. I have a habit of doing what isnt op and the main thing.hell I even play ap kog and jungle susaN frequently (still miss being the only person who play kha though.)
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Posted 3/5/2013 9:52:05 PMi see a lot of people disagreeing with hash here but uh...his whole point is validated by the BOTRK thing, you know. they buff an item that was already decent and balanced (albeit underused), then they hotfix its stats/price in a matter of days. this, btw, being something hash predicted in the video.
this is exactly what he's talking about.
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Posted 3/5/2013 7:12:19 PMI have to agree about Riot nerfing champs the minute they feel strong.
I can already sense Morello hovering above J4 and Elise with the nerf bat.... 0_0
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Posted 3/5/2013 4:26:39 AM"The worst part is that most of their nerfs seem to be aimed at incredibly low ELO problems. Darius? Garen? Warmogs? These were a non issue for real balance and yet they're getting attention before the actual issues are being addressed."
agreed. im a believer that riot test staff is full of low elo players. not bashing riot, but they need to either change their approach to testing, or hire new people. this isnt the fault of Xepherous and Morello as they dont deal with exact numbers. this is the fault of the testing team
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Posted 3/5/2013 6:28:34 AMI disagree with that. They are most likely nerfing low elo champions because most players are very low skilled. It's all about money not about real balance.
Though I agree that they should start recruiting new people.
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Posted 3/13/2013 12:42:20 AMRiot has 2500 elo players for testing.
League of Warmogs was getting to the point where if you didn't have insane penetration/reduction kits or % health damage kits or both (*COUGH* VI *COUGH*) you were basically throwing rocks at 10 foot walls of play-doh.
Garen consistently had the 3rd highest win rate across almost all ELOs. Behind Rumble and Singed. Rumble has always been that black sheep OP champ (except when that flamethrower bug-fix made him stupid broken). I can't explain singed, except maybe league of warmogs.
Darius was just because he pissed people off. He never was a balance issue after his release nerf.
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Posted 3/4/2013 11:37:00 PMif alex ich played *insert random ap* you would all be playing it. just like when diamond played xin, everyone did.