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Need advice on how to carry a match.

  • #1

    Hey everyone,

    I need some advice on how to carry low ranked Solo/duo teams to a win. Other people seem to be able to do this, but i cant figure out what im doing wrong please help ! Here is a quick over view of how things look through my eyes.

    I do everything i can and nothing is working for me except for when i get a good team, then its a steam roll. Tonight for instance, i was last pick so i said "fill, i play all roles well". I got adc, i chose cait to counter pick the vayne. I killed my tower AND mids tower by the 12 minute mark plus 70 cs and a kill. killed top tower and 2 more inner towers by around 25 mins. vayne had 50 cs 0 kills 0 assist, but a semi fed enemy rengar existed, but we had a fully stacked jungle cho. we had only lost 1 tower... in the bag right?... nope

    my build was vamp cepter, IE, zeal.(later became staic shiv and started the last whisper). standard solid cait build.

    every team fight no one would peel. they all charged passed cho into the team fight dieing instantly leaving me alone to face rengar and mundo who both freely walked straight to me through my still alive team. this happend about 5 times in a row and then we promptly lost all towers up mid and the nexus(i managed a triple kill defending alone). I run into this all the time, 2-3 people who dont know how to team fight and they just throw your game so hard.

    i try to tell them to peel for me or how to win the team fights for the game at hand, but then im met with STFU noob dont tell me what to do.

    If i jungle i gank 3-5 times by lv 5 and usually get at least 1 kill and never fall behind in levels, i always give mid blue. cant carry

    if i mid i often get a kill or 2 by lv 6-8 and roam for ganks. still cant carry

    If im support i get kills for my adc and carpet bomb the map with wards, then play body guard in team fights. still cant carry 

    top... meh im weak top so i just play safe and farm for mid game.

    im only winning about 25% of my games atm, I know im missing something.. other people can carry so it has to be me, but i dont know what im missing.

  • #2

    Quote from DuskSC2 »

    Hey everyone,

    I need some advice on how to carry low ranked Solo/duo teams to a win. Other people seem to be able to do this, but i cant figure out what im doing wrong please help ! Here is a quick over view of how things look through my eyes.

    I do everything i can and nothing is working for me except for when i get a good team, then its a steam roll. Tonight for instance, i was last pick so i said "fill, i play all roles well". I got adc, i chose cait to counter pick the vayne. I killed my tower AND mids tower by the 12 minute mark plus 70 cs and a kill. killed top tower and 2 more inner towers by around 25 mins. vayne had 50 cs 0 kills 0 assist, but a semi fed enemy rengar existed, but we had a fully stacked jungle cho. we had only lost 1 tower... in the bag right?... nope

    my build was vamp cepter, IE, zeal.(later became staic shiv and started the last whisper). standard solid cait build.

    every team fight no one would peel. they all charged passed cho into the team fight dieing instantly leaving me alone to face rengar and mundo who both freely walked straight to me through my still alive team. this happend about 5 times in a row and then we promptly lost all towers up mid and the nexus(i managed a triple kill defending alone). I run into this all the time, 2-3 people who dont know how to team fight and they just throw your game so hard.

    i try to tell them to peel for me or how to win the team fights for the game at hand, but then im met with STFU noob dont tell me what to do.

    If i jungle i gank 3-5 times by lv 5 and usually get at least 1 kill and never fall behind in levels, i always give mid blue. cant carry

    if i mid i often get a kill or 2 by lv 6-8 and roam for ganks. still cant carry

    If im support i get kills for my adc and carpet bomb the map with wards, then play body guard in team fights. still cant carry 

    top... meh im weak top so i just play safe and farm for mid game.

    im only winning about 25% of my games atm, I know im missing something.. other people can carry so it has to be me, but i dont know what im missing.

    Stop 'always' doing things and be more felixble in your game plan.  Ward more in every role if your team lacks vision. And shorter commands for your team, if 'Attack Vayne or Ahri, not Ali', 'group', 'run', 'run', 'run', 'run', 'don't fight!', 'group', is really to hard for your team then you should at least be able to take advantage of the fact the other team will be similar - practice an assassin, then don't play fair.

    I have no idea what I am doing, honest. http://www.lolking.net/summoner/oce/304784

  • #3

    I agree with Sagethyme about assassins, and playing to your opponent's weaknesses, at least for earlier levels, tiers or whatever. Otherwise play champions that don't get played often so that your opponents don't know what to do, or master a role/couple of champions. Pro's and people who are climbing seem to think this is the way to go.

    Learn to kite and self peel as ADC. It's not easy but if you can master that then most champions should lose to you. Support you would have to get really good with to carry, or play Leona, Taric, Blitz, Thresh and learn to play super aggressive but know how to get out of bad situations, which requires you to get quite good with them. Get play carry junglers, master them, learn to do crazy ganks and not to rely on team mates. Top and Mid kinda fit in with the jungle I guess.

    Also always duoque if you can, with a friend or someone who you work well with, having two people to carry makes it a lot easier.

    These are almost word for word tips friends have given me, several of whom have carried themselves.

  • #4

    thanks, Solid tips! ill see what i can do, i appreciate the response. 

  • #5

    Speaking as someone who is also trying to claw his way out of the place that doesn't exist .... i'd say

     Duo que definetly , and idealy one of you be adc, i've lost soooooo many games lately to the goddamed adc derping around the map lategame , getting raped then loosing 4v5 to the push its pants on head retarded.

     Alot of ppl will prolly tell you learn a lane or a champ very well and just play that. That would prolly work if you can get that champ constantly, but in my experience ppl rage hard if they dont get "their" lanes and just start trolling. So just get a champ or two decently for every role. ATM (i dono what elo you are tho) but i'd say Garen / kha / akali top . Lux / akali / kha / swain / talon and actualy many others mid, TF is good but if you dont know how to play him hes squishy as hell and has some probs early. Cait / ez / draven (especialy if your good on him, win games by yourself) bot. Taric (tho he is getting nerfed) / Blitz / Lulu / zyra supp . Jarv / xin jung . As far as jungle goes there are a few good ones up to like low plat such as amumu and malph but the irony is, up to high elo amumu will be banned 99% of the time, malph as well, and by the time ppl dont ban them, they know how to counter them. Also, i dont see him played alot but a friend of mine absolutly WRECKS on zed jung. Hes a very high skillcap hero and some things shut him down hard (zhonyas / QSS) but from personal experience ive seen him carry by himself.

    The more i think of it, yeah , learning zed would prolly help, hes sorta like shaco 2.0. Absolutly TRACTOR speed , just mows the jung down and W lets you avoid alot of wards and get consistent ganks bot, something few junglers can do easily with the constant ward coverage, but you can use W on the pruple golem tribrush (to the left of purples tower) and land allmost in the river brush, negating blue tribrush ward, lane wards and dragon ward, unless there's a ward IN the river brush (wich ppl rarely do nowadays) your's adc's getting feeeeeed.

    Meh im rambling again, basicaly my counterintuitive advice is if you STRICTLY want to climb elo (versus what alot of ppl seem to be saying - "It doesnt matter if you loose dude as long as you get better slowly you'll win eventualy") i'd just go for fotm champs, Jarv / xin / garen etc if your team needs some beef akali / kha / zed if you allready have a front line. Also remember rng is rng, this i can barely do myself but dont take any game to heart, be glad on the wins you legitimately got and forgot the total bs loses, state of mind matters alot. At the end of s2 i was trying to raise my tier ..... and ended up loosing 14! (fourfuckinteen) games in a row didnt play for 4 months.... After like game 4-5 i was allready starting each game like "meh whatever" a lane would have to be 8-0 by min 10 to get my head back in the game in that state... 

    PS: One last thing i swear tell your team how to counter, the current 'meta' (again, at lower elo at least) is counterable generaly with two things. In my experience either the entire team is bursty, in wich case tell your ap to go zhonyas , adcs to go QSS / GA OR more commonly EVERYONE exept the adc has a warmog and or sunfire in wich case BotRK and LT work absolutly WONDERS. Its how me and that friend i mentioned usualy end up winning  BotRK + LW and you just go tank hunter mode.

    So if you go in the game with the attitude of I WILL CARRY this SINGLE game, thats basically spoken not how it works. Your skill will NOT help you to win A SINGLE GAME but a certain percentage of games. - Slayerle 2013

  • #6

    keep playing is honestly the best advice there is, if you 'belong' somewhere, you'll get there just by playing. 
    there is no 'secret strategy' as to how to carry this game, it's not very in-depth. 
    win lane, roam, influence lanes, call objectives - win game. 

    Last edited by DARKWING: 2/21/2013 8:27:48 PM
  • #7

    Get good at jungling, regardless of who you decide to get good with. Junglers may not always be able to carry games in the damage sense but they( along with mids to some extent) set their team's up for success by making plays and being in the right place at the right time. You have so much power to influence the game as a jungler.

  • #8

    Thanks for all the advice. just wanted to update that tonight i went 8 wins 1 loss and got promoted easily. best forum post i ever made ! TY very much everyone. doing jungle vi, elise, top and leona support. Im able to make power plays and then my team magically starts communicating instead of fighting !

    Last edited by DuskSC2: 2/24/2013 3:36:45 AM
  • #9

    Duh as aphromoo said if your doing well then your team does well  and if you allow them to do well.It like a pandemic

  • #10

    Don't play a role you're not good at. "All Trades known, all Trades dull"  It's good to know HOW to play every lane, how to position, initiate, when, how to peel. But you won't know every top, jungle, and mid match-up for everybody on your team, and even if you do you can't account for someone else's skill in that champion or role.  Just try to memorize the bot lane combinations, because that is just absurd!

    Learning how to position is good, how and what to build is also good. How to self-kite? THAT'S SOME DIFFICULT STUFF!  If you're an AD Carry, you know how to do that.

    Learning how to jungle? Easy!  How to Gank, Ward, defend lanes? A bit of practice!  Jungle match-ups against Junglers, Counter Jungling, working on a limited item budget, what lanes you can or can't gank, what champions are prone to roam, which lanes you can save, commanding the team like some kinda Field Commander? Even more work.  Timers on Blue's and Reds, Dragons and Barons.  At what levels you can gank certain champions, enemy summoner spell cooldowns... Yeah, learning it is one thing, but it takes practice to keep up.

    Then we got Top lane and all that Shenangians, and Mid lane is it's own MINEFIELD of problems.  I'd actually say Mid and Ranged AD are the more Mechanical of roles, while Support and Jungler the more knowledgable.  With top lane a huge variance of everybody's problems.

     

    And then you have to factor in the Meta and how it shifts. How your OP Lee Sin is no longer useful, and thus any champion you'd counter by picking him is therefor going to need a new counter, or how Hecarim can dominate you, Nautilus and Rengar can't jungling properly anymore, Xin Zhao has made it back into the lists, Boots of Mobi are now standard, how everybody wards MORE and you need Vision wards yourself, Mid's arn't as DEPENDENT on blue but do still love it.

    AGUAHAAH, Just pick one role, and learn how to play it really really well. And when you've done that, branch out a little bit, learn how the other Champions play, because that's a whole new game experience right there.  You don't see Professionals switching who's the Jungler and who's the AD Carry every game, do you?

    if some professional team come up who does randomly switch which players play which roles just for Lolz Tourneys....i'ma be both shocked, and probably a fan, CUZ THAT AIN'T EZ.

  • #11

    IMO, low ranked game should be focus on early game.

    i cant stress enough how important early game is!

    players will start blame on eachother when they had a bad game start. that is your advantage.

    pick early-dominate champion,get first blood,push your lane and start roam with your teammates

    take down turret, kill the dragon,keep telling enemy how bad his teammate is

    surrender at 20, end of story

  • #12

    Imo for low elo games the biggest factor is luck so I suggest working on that first. If you got shitty luck (down syndrome team) then you are screwed and nothing will help you.

    And no, if you are a fed mid your success will not spread on the whole team. If you got 10/2 after 20 minutes, you roamed, warded and have correct build, then you look at your 0/3 top, 0/4 jungler, 1/7/2 adc and 0/5/2 support you can be assured that you are completely fucked because your team is too mongoloid to carry. The same off course goes for bot or top lane.

  • #13

    If you are the jungler:

    Concentrate your ganking on lanes with assassins and bring a jungler with enough cc to do so. Assassins snowball the hardest and they can help you win the game the easiest. Next is mid. If your mid has point-and-click cc, gank the heck out of him.
    Bottom lane is most of the time too risky to gank and you should only do that, if your team has the cc to protect a fed ad carry.

    Make the most out of your time and figure out a plan on who is going to be doing what at which time. You need knowledge of the game there. Akali's are going to use their shroud if they want to win their lane. Just watch the lanes from time to time and look for enemies who like to use their escapes. Those who are aggressive early are the ones, who are easiest to bait and gank.

    If you are the mid:

    Can you kill your lane opponent? Can you outpush him? Are you more useful than him, if you are both equally farmed? If your answer is no to all of these, you got outpicked. Don't let that happen. If you know, that you can't kill your enemy (Katarina vs Kassadin post-6), but would win by simply pushing 24/7, you can adjust your runes to reflect that playstyle. Take any advantage you can get, because sometimes mres marks and armor seals are the best option even for a mage.

    If you are ad carry:

    If you are way better than the Elo you are playing at, it's a good role to carry and lead the team. If you are just getting started to ranked, this is the worst you can pick. The bottom lane is won 60% because of the support. Take ad carries, who are self-sufficient and fit into most comps.

    If you are the support:

    Outplay the enemy support (who was most likely forced into the role at lower Elo), take the tower, ward deep and roam. Catch people at buffs with your team, pink ward objectives. The whole stuff that no one does at lower Elo.

    If you are the top:

    Outpick the other laner or pick something safe you are good with. Getting countered at top is asking to lose in solo queue. You won't gain a lot of sympathy from your jungler, when you cry for ganks all the time, so don't get yourself into that situation. "But I am first-pick!". Easy, don't pick top lane then. You are better than your team mates, right? Counterpick some lane with a champion you know well and steam-roll the enemy.

    General:

    Keep the moral high. If it is low, try to encourage your mates by reminding of ways how to still win the game. First dragon gone, 3 of you died and everyone is raging? Write down the estimated timer of Dragon and ambush an enemy laner, when it's up again. At lower Elo people don't time objectives well enough and if you*re the first to be there, you have an advantage and can atleast waste their time or scare them off.

    If your team is behind, don't team fight. Stall for time in any way possible. Catch people off-guard with wards at buffs. Advantages diminish with time and late-late-game no one gives a damn about that ultra fed ap carry anymore.

    Like my posts? Check out my youtube channel. Woo! Exciting!

  • #14

    just play darius and kill their jungler and top 1v2.

  • #15

    Just do what 90% of the golden elo players do, pick  one of the latest FotM champions and win your lane without knowing how the game or said champ works. Snowball thereafter for a win.

    "Soraka is definitely best unicorn" : Albert Einstein 

  • #16

    Sometimes, especially with regards to your specific situation, nothing much can be done. If your team absolutely refuses to peel for you when they have a Rengar/Mundo combination, do what you can. Buy an early defensive item, or even two (in this case I would personally go for Frozen Mallet and start orb walking). Better to survive and do a little less damage then be insta-gibbed and do no damage.

  • #18

    Quote from Misticaltom »

    Don't play a role you're not good at. "All Trades known, all Trades dull"  It's good to know HOW to play every lane, how to position, initiate, when, how to peel. But you won't know every top, jungle, and mid match-up for everybody on your team, and even if you do you can't account for someone else's skill in that champion or role.  Just try to memorize the bot lane combinations, because that is just absurd!

    Learning how to position is good, how and what to build is also good. How to self-kite? THAT'S SOME DIFFICULT STUFF!  If you're an AD Carry, you know how to do that.

    Learning how to jungle? Easy!  How to Gank, Ward, defend lanes? A bit of practice!  Jungle match-ups against Junglers, Counter Jungling, working on a limited item budget, what lanes you can or can't gank, what champions are prone to roam, which lanes you can save, commanding the team like some kinda Field Commander? Even more work.  Timers on Blue's and Reds, Dragons and Barons.  At what levels you can gank certain champions, enemy summoner spell cooldowns... Yeah, learning it is one thing, but it takes practice to keep up.

    Then we got Top lane and all that Shenangians, and Mid lane is it's own MINEFIELD of problems.  I'd actually say Mid and Ranged AD are the more Mechanical of roles, while Support and Jungler the more knowledgable.  With top lane a huge variance of everybody's problems.

     

    And then you have to factor in the Meta and how it shifts. How your OP Lee Sin is no longer useful, and thus any champion you'd counter by picking him is therefor going to need a new counter, or how Hecarim can dominate you, Nautilus and Rengar can't jungling properly anymore, Xin Zhao has made it back into the lists, Boots of Mobi are now standard, how everybody wards MORE and you need Vision wards yourself, Mid's arn't as DEPENDENT on blue but do still love it.

    AGUAHAAH, Just pick one role, and learn how to play it really really well. And when you've done that, branch out a little bit, learn how the other Champions play, because that's a whole new game experience right there.  You don't see Professionals switching who's the Jungler and who's the AD Carry every game, do you?

    if some professional team come up who does randomly switch which players play which roles just for Lolz Tourneys....i'ma be both shocked, and probably a fan, CUZ THAT AIN'T EZ.

    that was beautiful

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