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Why ban Vayne in solo q?

  • #41

    Reason I ban her is because of Murphy`s law. For few weeks already, I had vayne in about 70% of games I played. From all of those games, I remember only ONE vayne out of all of them being in my team did any good actually. I also remember only maybe 2 vayne players from enemy team doing badly. So... vayne stays banned in games where I decide until they remove that fuking true dmg.

    I agree with that... Enemy Vaynes lately have just been carrying every game I lose. For a while, I felt like I had close to a 100% loss ratio against Draven, and I still feel that way about Nocturne. For whatever reason. I figure why tempt fate to hand you your 8th mega-fed Vayne in a row?

  • #42

    If she get fed, it become nearly impossible to escape her and beat her. Since she always got CC machine like Blitz, Leona and possibly Thresh/Alistar, she always have time to get that 3rd shot and stuff like that.

    Only Kogmaw can beat the shit-out of her in straight duel because of his insane DPS (as long as he has an oracle if she was too close and couldn't kite her), and maybe draven early.

    Since people know that she is FotM, they play her. And since their support know that vayne need kill, they make a kill lane.

    As a jungler, I make sure to take a huge CC machine/strong ganker like Zac, Sej, J4, Amumu to make her early a living nightmare.

  • #43

    Quote from klocugh12 »

    Quote from KajzzeR »

    Reason I ban her is because of Murphy`s law. For few weeks already, I had vayne in about 70% of games I played. From all of those games, I remember only ONE vayne out of all of them being in my team did any good actually. I also remember only maybe 2 vayne players from enemy team doing badly. So... vayne stays banned in games where I decide until they remove that fuking true dmg.
    I also like to ban Ahri, because if she is not banned 99%, she will be picked, mostly by my enemies.
    3rd ban is usually Yi... Notice the similarities? All got spammable true dmg.

    What's the big deal with true dmg? Get some HP. And in case of Vayne, FH or Randuins'.

    Vayne has percent health true damage and almost always rushes a BOTRK. Sure a frozen heart or Randuins works but you don't really want to be rushing those on a carry, who is more likely to give away kills during lane phase.

  • #44

    If Vayne had a terrible early game it would be fine. But the problem is Vayne isn't as weak as Kog'Maw or Tristana during the laning phase, but she is easily as strong as them and much stronger than them against Tanks.

    Betrayer... In truth, it was I who was betrayed. Still, I am hunted. Still, I am hated. Now, my blind eyes see what others cannot: that sometimes the hand of fate must be forced! Now go forth... unleash the tides of Doom... Upon all those...who would oppose us.

  • #45

    By the time that true damage starts to add up to serious threat, it's probably at least mid if not mid-late game already and you more then likely have 2, maybe 3 big items done. I'd say it's good time to start assessing what is biggest threat to you and itemize accordingly if you think you need it right now. In case of marksmen it's more likely RO than FH anyway, so that HP boost would still come in handy against other sources and as marksman you won't have enough HP to utilize pure armor item well anyway.

    Last edited by klocugh12: 8/17/2013 6:37:28 AM
  • #46

    Because tbh the only ap mid that really stomps on her is ryze because he can get burst and a frozen heart before she can get bt/ie + zeal/pd and lw.

    If the vayne is smart and rushes lw it's pretty much over because with good tanks you can't ever get to her due to tumble.

     

    Also because taking her down without hard cc (or even with) requires co-ord or aoe. I choose to go with aoe because co-ord in solo q is like finding a non-annoying teemo.

  • #47

    She gets BotRK and gets a stupid spike of damage that allows her to 1v1 other adc's and seeing that you can't rely on your teammates as much as you should they will most likely feed her idiotically. Also in solo queue games the games will tend to go on for a while, in which Vayne will eventually become a lategame beast and destroy teamfights.

  • #48

    Quote from Rexdale_Punjabi »

    Because tbh the only ap mid that really stomps on her is ryze because he can get burst and a frozen heart before she can get bt/ie + zeal/pd and lw.

    If the vayne is smart and rushes lw it's pretty much over because with good tanks you can't ever get to her due to tumble.

     

    Also because taking her down without hard cc (or even with) requires co-ord or aoe. I choose to go with aoe because co-ord in solo q is like finding a non-annoying teemo.

    Ryze tend to get Tear ==> RoA in most builds so Frozen Heart will take some time after competing those two anyway. By that time, Ryze's Tear + RoA should be stacked nicely so he is strong already without the Armour + CDR from Glacial Shroud. On the other hand, Vayne is already really strong after getting only BoRK as the active + condem into wall + Vayne passive mean she can chase you down or run away pretty easily in 1 v  1. When you get to late game though, you are right in saying that Ryze is a handful to deal with by a Vayne.

    (Also, I think Ryze is more a sustained damage mage than burst mage but I digress)

    I think why Vayne is relatively stronger (and more popular) is because many the champions or ways which can deal with her well got nerfed, for example:

     

    1. The bruiser junglers who can jump on her, can hold her down and is tanky with CC (e.g. Vi, Xin, Jarvan)

    2. The in-and-out instagib champions with insane burst (e.g. Kha'Zix, Zed)

    3. Constant + continuous poke / siegeing (e.g. Nidalee + Jayce with tear nerfs)

    4. Constant push and turret taking comps (i.e. Caitlyn)

    5. Nerfs to Randuin's Omen (one of the best item to deal with Vayne) also meant that it is less effective to build against her as a tank / bruiser.

    TL,DR:

    Riot made Vayne relatively stronger due to changes and nerfs to turrets, other champions or items:

    • Riot brought late-game Vayne forward into games with the introduction of BoRK
    • Riot nerfed a lot of champion or strategy (and Randuin's Omen) that deal with Vayne well
    • Riot nerfed the other popular ADC (e.g. Cait, Draven, Ez)

    End result:

    Vayne feels stronger so people like to play her more (whether she is actually stronger or not is beside the point, people ban what they think is strong in solo Q)

  • #49

    I ban her sometimes because I dont play her (meaning I cant pick her) and in the hands of someone who can she can be a nightmare. With most of her counters having been hit by the nerf hammers, her kit shines that much more as one containing outrageous DPS if not shut down, which is even harder to do now as her counters arent quite as strong, on top of her already having self-peel and even a stealth for escape. Shes just not all that fun to play against.

  • #50

    To play against vayne, you just need to be sure that your team has an answer to her. It's either strong single-target hard CC, or good aoe CC. Generally, things like Amumu, Malzahar, Twisted Fate, Taric, Fiddlesticks, Sona and such make her life a nightmare even if she's fed. Do not rely on skillshot CC as she can dodge it.

    Combo Amumu's ult into Sona ult to make Vayne break her keyboard from frustration. Doesn't matter how much of a "skilled player" is she, chain ults onto her and it's one dead Vayne. Her low attack range means she has to expose herself in danger of getting wrecked by chain CC. If she waits until those ults are gone in a teamfight, you're essentially 5v4.

    Last edited by Rewenger: 8/19/2013 12:16:08 AM
  • #51

    hypercarry who is suppose to have a weak early game, but in all honestly, is rlly strong with the right support and once botrk is  purchased she can 1v1 any1

    ~Vuldin Archives.

    Diamond V Taric's Enforcers 

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