Reign of Gaming

the difficulty of jungling is dependent more on gameplay and mechanics than actual champion usage. it's more about learning to predict when an opponent will overextend and positioning yourself to intercept them in time. you need to develop an acute sense of map awareness, which is what separates the farmers from the actual junglers. the difference is quite noticeable, especially when you play games where it seems like the jungler is omnipresent, and always there when shit goes down. arguing about champion difficulty is pretty pointless when the mechanics of the jungle are what determine the skill of the jungler.

Thanks man! I appreciate the praise. Definitely gonna keep writing articles until the folks on this site feature me. I got turned down from the newsoflegends position posted on solomid; but fuck that shit. I'll just write articles anyway.

not to plug my own blog or anything, but I wrote a series of articles on champion selection and skill synergies which is relevant to the discussion.

pastoulio.blogspot.com

namely, the issue of 'easy to play' vs. 'difficult' champions becomes kind of a moot point when considering what each brings to a team. a lot of champions are listed as 'difficult' because their skills are conditional and depend upon synergy from allies in order to function. most of the time in ranked, your allies will not pick champions specifically to synergize with you, and a particular champion can seem weak as a result.

any points about viktor here are set in a folly produced by hopes that people will do stupid things. this just isn't the case.

Except that is exactly what you're doing. There is no conceivable situation in which Katarina can successfully engage on a Viktor without significantly outplaying him (and if that's the case, it's an issue of player skill).

Viktor has two ways to stop Katarina's channel and both of these abilities are usable at range. This means that even if I am forced to use one ability, I can still hold back the other to react to your play, and you can't even safely engage my allies without me stopping you.

Viktor has no channeled skills, cannot be interrupted, and you have to be in his face to have a hope of killing him. Katarina relies on having shunpo targets and exhausting all the crowd control on the enemy team so that she can channel uninterrupted. If anyone is talking about "testing champions in a perfect vacuum," it's you.

not "mindlessly waste". it'd just be sparringly used. same with the katarina, who would also avoid using her shunpo offensively unless viktor's w is on cooldown, and vice versa.

It's not just the gravity field that counters katarina; it's that Chaos Storm completely shuts her down. Why would you ever cast Gravity Field "sparingly" against an opponent that can teleport out of it? The only time you should ever be using Gravity Field against Katarina is when she shunpos to you or an ally, and therefore cannot escape without flash. If she escapes, good, you just got her to burn flash. If not, she's food.

and to make the point again, the more utility based champions i mentioned earlier will have a better time against gap-closing champions than viktor.

We're arguing hypotheticals at this point.

and so why wouldn't the katarina wait until viktor drops his w in the teamfight,

Because she'll lose the fight for her team by doing nothing. Viktor has one job in a teamfight: save his ultimate for Katarina.

or better yet bait the stun and then use the ultimate.

or even more effectively, take cleanse, drop the ult, let it channel for a kill/assist, use cleanse, and continue her murderous spree. 

Good luck winning the lane without ignite. Cleanse on Kat is borderline retarded, do I even need to explain why?

tf does counter ahri in that instance. but viktor doesn't really counter katarina. he just counters impatient or unaware player

No. By your logic, anyone with a targeted stun counters Ahri; up to and including Taric. But Viktor, with an AOE Stun and an instant-cast silence doesn't counter a character that relies on a channelled ultimate to deal the majority of her damage? Please, I've seen enough.

Quote from Apollinarius »

He has amazing ratios, good cc, a shield, and massive aoe damage ultimate. So, what's the problem? Usability. His abilities are awkward to use. His Q shield only appears after the ability has bounced back to him. If you're trading against Ryze or Anivia, you will have eaten the trade spells before the shield gets to you. His E sometimes hits things it should definitely have missed and sometimes it goes right through enemies doing no damage. His W is a fantastic control spell, but it falters in the current meta that has dashes on every assassin and bruiser around. If the Gravity Augment increased its radius instead of cast range, he would have a great way of dealing with those pesky Zed/Khazix/Xin/Irelia/Katarina/Lee Sin/Ezreal players. Finally, his R. If you could reliably cast it on top of the enemy so you don't lose the initial damage, the way Annie does, he'd be god. As it is, you can get a solid R initial cast on the enemy carry maybe once per game because unlike Flash+Tibbers, Flash+Storm is fairly easily avoided by the enemy, and it gets you killed.

It comes down to how you use his skills. Q should be used defensively, when you're in the process of being attacked (so the shield actually gets used). Viktor doesn't trade damage; he pokes you down from long-range with E, then goes in for the kill with Q and R.

The fact that most of those assassins/bruisers have gap closers is actually a boon to Viktor's play; because it makes their motions predictable. You can guarantee that W will stun an opponent, once they've used their gap closer. The skill is meant to be used reactively, and if an opponent jumps to you or a teammate, they're as good as trapped. Part of the reason why Viktor is great against Kat is because she puts herself at severe risk by offensively using shunpo. Sure, Zed/Khazix/Xin/Irelia/Lee can give you problems, but no mage has an easy time against them; at least Gravity Field gives you and your allies a response to their initiation.

I'm going to have to disagree about Flash+Storm, you won't believe how many kills I get that way. Storm has incredible range and radius of effect; there have been plenty of times where an enemy just barely escapes my E+Q, only to get storm dropped right on them.

I'm not sure what you mean about R, because it locks on to targets if you hit them with the initial AOE. Unlike Tibbers, it can't be minion blocked or killed.

dunno. i think you guys are looking at viktor in this beautiful little vacuum where everyone's retarded and fall for all your combos.

You don't win games by hoping opponents fall for your tricks. You win games by giving your opponents no choice but to do so.

the problem with viktor isn't viktor. it's just that there are champions that do what he does, albeit slightly better. viktor has utility/burst, but then, why not just pick orianna/anivia/zyra? like him for his burst though huh? well, why not just pick katarina/akali/ahri? 

Because I don't want to play those champions.
Because I beat those champions as Viktor.
Because saying things like "Mage X has utility/burst but it's not as good as Mage Y" is asinine when they have different kits.
There's a reason this game has over a hundred champions instead of just ten. You don't break the meta by obeying it.

he isn't bad. just not on par with other champions in his own role.

Being different is not the same as being worse than another champion.
Anivia can wall off enemies, but can simultaneously wall off allies as well. Gravity Field doesn't do that.
Orianna has incredible team synergy, but Viktor has comparable synergy with more offense.
Zyra has lots of interesting tools at her disposal, but I've also never lost to one as Viktor.

Have you ever played Akali/Ahri vs. Viktor? It's painful for them, especially Akali. I'd even go as far as to say that Viktor counters Kat (if not in lane, then in teamfights).

Don't dismiss champions based on the meta. Viktor fits into a lot of teams, and is a strong pick right now.

Viktor is very capable of large burst damage. Notice the ratios on his skills: .65 on Q; .7 on E (.91 with Death Augment); .55 on R's initial hit, but 2.23 over the entire duration. These are thoroughly above-average values.

But let's get a little more in-depth than just "big numbers big damage". There's a concept in Starcraft called "Timing", where you plan to have a whole bunch of elements synchronize, in hopes that what you have at that particular moment is stronger than what your opponent has. This exists in League of Legends too, and has everything to do with when you are able to acquire big items. Viktor can achieve a significant advantage over just about every other AP Mid once he reaches the 1000g threshold (around 5-6 minutes); because you can return to lane with a Death Augment, and suddenly your Death Ray hits like a truck. Your lane pushing power goes through the roof, and if your jungler is compliant, you'll also be getting a blue buff soon. Suddenly, Viktor has an overwhelming advantage and kill potential, because no other mage can get a comparable item to Death Augment for 1000g. This timing window allows you to absolutely destroy most other AP mids; and if you aren't outright winning the lane, you should at least be ahead in farm.

Combine that with the fact that Viktor can comfortably play a poke game, and he's suddenly a force you can no longer ignore, and he's always dangerous.

Viktor has been my main for over a year now. I do not lose lane unless I'm getting jungle camped. There are literally no AP Mids that can touch me.

I wrote a guide for Viktor and regularly maintain it: www.solomid.net/guides.php?g=17919-pastoulio-viktor-build-guide
I wouldn't advise using Aranium's guide, even though it is featured. Most of it is outdated, or just flat-out wrong. Sure it has pictures, but do you really need an illustrated guide on how to place Gravity Field to block paths?

I wouldn't say that Viktor is sleeper OP, but he has amazing versatility. Gravity Field and Death Ray are enormously powerful tools that are constantly underestimated. He's one of the best pushing champions in the game; and starts becoming terrifying once you've purchased Death Augment. One thing I've noticed about Viktor over other AP mids, is the sheer amount of flexibility with which you can build him. He is a true toolbox mage, and can make use of every item which stacks AP. What I mean by this, is that if the situation calls for an item, you can build it without repercussion.

Need Deathfire Grasp? No problem; it works on Viktor.
Lichbane for tower pushing and sustained damage? It's one of my favourite items and his cooldowns synchronize.
Rylai's? Death Ray is castable while moving; now you can kite people. This also makes your ultimate inescapable.
Liandry's? Works great with all your damaging skills.

It goes on and on. Viktor doesn't see play because he is polarizing and difficult to use. But he's very rewarding when played effectively. I strongly advise learning the champion. I used to main Twisted Fate and Swain; and there were matchups with those champions that you would just lose. Not the case with Viktor; I crush opponents equally.