Reign of Gaming

Quote from darkChozo »

Quote from Insanitism »

Skill shot r is a terrible idea

Assasins, are about burst, if you hit the tank with the shot instead of the adc....Wow

Also, unlike an intiation, (lee q) r is usually used after a q mark, etc.

Please dont do that to her

Read closer, the suggestion is a passthrough skillshot plus a targeted reactivation. Assuming you hit the target (it can be dodged but can't be blocked; think Ez W or Zed Q), you'll be able to targeted dash just like you can now.

#readshitbeforeyoucomplain

the "win-more" thing is less about snowballing and more about the redundancies of the item. that the item itself isn't helping as much as other factors are. 

if you're snowballing as riven, building BT, BC, LW, and GA are more or less better rushes than RH. and if you build RH while snowballing and continue to win, your success is probably based more on their incompetence, your team comp, or just how far ahead in levels and gold you are. not that RH is actively helping you.

Quote from Glenhimself »

Quote from Wiltsee »

elise harasses singed easily and because her damage is based on health (a resource singed stacks) your burst never falls off when you fight him. very winnable lane.

kog'maw/thresh should've had an easy time against two laners with a) no escapes and b) less range/cc. thresh can trade well against lulu (well relatively anyway since lulu out-trades like everybody) and kog's poke/slow/range over MF should've led to an easy lane win.

fid ganks on either lane will have easily out-bursted most of the lanes (elise + fid = chain cc on singed plus great damage, mordekaiser + fid = easy burst on swain, plus morde has percentage health ult to counter swain's health-stacking, fid fear in bot-lane means easy set ups for hooks/slows from kog/thresh. and because no one on their team has an escape, the ganks are that much easier).

in teamfights, a good pick on either lulu or mf would've been more or less GG. if you were to initiate the fight with either elise or thresh by stunning the right target, a skirmish begins that gives fid an easy opening to land a clean ult. when he ults, he fears MF no problem, either a) cancelling her ult or b) fearing her so long she dies before she can get it off. as elise you should be back there with fid on the same target, which more or less secures a dead MF.

mordekaiser should be focusing his efforts on swain, who's most likely moved up toward your backline. alongisde his damage, you and fid should've had no problem turning onto swain after mf dies. 

while this is happening kog/thresh kite naut and singed for days with 3 slows, one stun, a shield, and incredible range. as their backline drops dead, the fight turns into a 5 v 2; even if kog or thresh dies, which they may, it's easy for you guys to clean up.

of course this is assuming the fiddlesticks ult hasn't already triple-killed the team, and that naut/singed didn't draw their attention to fid during his ult. which, if they did, kog gets to aa with no problem.

not to mention 3 members of your team do % health damage, and with 3 members of their team that require stacking health, your overall damage never falls off. 

the only way you lose this teamfight is if a) one of you guys were out of position, b) someone failed to land certain spells on the right targets, and/or c) you guys were outplayed in the laning phase, letting them snowball into the mid-game.

i suspect C) is what happened to elise, fid, and bot lane. morde's success isn't quite as important as the rest of you guys.

Bot lane lost their tower fairly early and then decided to freeze the lane close to 2nd tower and farm, while the enemy team started forcing fights around the map.

Our first team fights actually started out pretty good, but in the end chasing and greed, with too little focus on objectives was the bane of our team.

But as I understand your analysis, then our team comp wasnt all as bad as I thought? Although with too much AP.

yeah it's not so bad at all. even with the ap your bound to build enough m.pen to nullify their MR (particularly abyssal scepter).

and from the successful teamfights your kog could get pretty big and do all the damage 30 minutes +. i'm a silver player myself, but just looking at the kits of the champions on your team vs. the kits of the champions on their team, there were definitely ways to win.

a lot of it depended on fiddlesticks though. and yeah getting caught out yourselves and fiending for kills over objectives is always trouble. i lose games 'cause of that stuff.

Quote from SpiffmeisterZ »

I don't know who to say as far as a pick considering the team comp other than something AD with sustain or burst.

What I can say for sure, however, is that your bot getting behind in lane really screws your 'protect the koggy' comp. You need him ahead or even when teamfights come around or it falls apart. Top you should have just had to keep as even as possible with Singed in farm and have had Kog ahead enough to shred him down while Thresh chained him and Fiddle had him feared. Add in Naut diving in and MF doing her bullet time while you're busy dealing with two people diving in that hard, however, and it really spelled a tough if not impossible time for your team without Kog coming out of lane just flat out fed.

Without that, everything fell apart.

elise harasses singed easily and because her damage is based on health (a resource singed stacks) your burst never falls off when you fight him. very winnable lane.

kog'maw/thresh should've had an easy time against two laners with a) no escapes and b) less range/cc. thresh can trade well against lulu (well relatively anyway since lulu out-trades like everybody) and kog's poke/slow/range over MF should've led to an easy lane win.

fid ganks on either lane will have easily out-bursted most of the lanes (elise + fid = chain cc on singed plus great damage, mordekaiser + fid = easy burst on swain, plus morde has percentage health ult to counter swain's health-stacking, fid fear in bot-lane means easy set ups for hooks/slows from kog/thresh. and because no one on their team has an escape, the ganks are that much easier).

in teamfights, a good pick on either lulu or mf would've been more or less GG. if you were to initiate the fight with either elise or thresh by stunning the right target, a skirmish begins that gives fid an easy opening to land a clean ult. when he ults, he fears MF no problem, either a) cancelling her ult or b) fearing her so long she dies before she can get it off. as elise you should be back there with fid on the same target, which more or less secures a dead MF.

mordekaiser should be focusing his efforts on swain, who's most likely moved up toward your backline. alongisde his damage, you and fid should've had no problem turning onto swain after mf dies. 

while this is happening kog/thresh kite naut and singed for days with 3 slows, one stun, a shield, and incredible range. as their backline drops dead, the fight turns into a 5 v 2; even if kog or thresh dies, which they may, it's easy for you guys to clean up.

of course this is assuming the fiddlesticks ult hasn't already triple-killed the team, and that naut/singed didn't draw their attention to fid during his ult. which, if they did, kog gets to aa with no problem.

not to mention 3 members of your team do % health damage, and with 3 members of their team that require stacking health, your overall damage never falls off. 

the only way you lose this teamfight is if a) one of you guys were out of position, b) someone failed to land certain spells on the right targets, and/or c) you guys were outplayed in the laning phase, letting them snowball into the mid-game.

i suspect C) is what happened to elise, fid, and bot lane. morde's success isn't quite as important as the rest of you guys.

honestly, teams don't require tanks if the lanes can outplay well enough. look at game 2 of the All-Star finals between china and korea: korea, the winning team (and a team that won in 28 minutes, and the win was more or less locked by about 15 minutes), had what looked like the most troll team (jayce top, gragas jungle, kha'zix mid, lulu/cait bot). i'm pretty sure in a standard champion select, there would be a lot of frustration from someone about how shit the team looks and how "omg wtf no tank???".

if you had just picked a top laner you were really comfortable with over forcing a tank pick, you could've probably a) smashed singed to snowball b) gank other lanes to help them snowball which would lead to c) a comfy lead that can be exploited through forced fights and constant objective-control.

after all, a tank can't tank if he and his team are behind.

meanwhile you can avert 5v5 and still win, but odds are you all have more damage than they do, so, as long as you all played it right, you'd still win.

by "as long as you all played it right", i mean any assassins not jumping in 5v1, the adc and support nicely positioned, and choosing the right moment/target to initiate on. picking people off as opposed to direct teamfighting is the goal in a tankless team.

tanks do matter, mind you. even in the korean game, gragas was more or less "tank". however, they're not worth forcing yourself to pick if it means you won't be comfortable and in control of your laning phase.

elise, by the way, is a good tank/frontline; she can engage, disrupt, and kill the enemy backline with relative ease, and this is more or less all you need to do. her rappel is a great way to absorb a lot of attention/cc while avoiding any lethal damage, leaving your backline open to kill whoever they want.

you may have just misplayed things.

fiddle is an excellent jungler to snowball things with, and especially amazing at counter-ganking thanks to hit ult/fear. watch zekent's streams; he jungles fid in challenger tier and often the team lacks what we'd consider a traditional tank. but his ganks are so well-placed and thought out that he straight outplays the team into victory. 

so, besides your bot lane, fid may have also made mistakes where he shouldn't have.

it's not really a matter of when a lane is fine (though if a laner is snowballing their lane ridiculously hard, definitely better to leave it alone; enemy laner not worth any gold). it's more of whether or not the benefits you gain from ganking the lane are worth it.

for example, when i know we're leveled enough to do dragon, i tend to start prioritizing bot lane to gank. the only time i may gank bot lane earlier is if a) the mid is roaming too or b) we have an aggressive support like leona/thresh (meaning so much lockdown CC/burst -- the gank is bound to work or at least force flash which may change things in the lane later on).

if we can get a turret off of it, i'll gank.

if i can break an even solo lane (Especially if a snowball heavy one like riven/akali/katarina etc.), i'll gank.

if i can repress a snowball-y lane (namely top lane teemo), i'll gank.

otherwise, i farm.

i guess i probably reiterated a lot of what people said here, but i hope mine is a little simpler to read and practically apply.

the mechanics involved with being an adc (attack move particularly) are the same mechanics cass requires to be really efficient with her DPS. you want to remain focused on one target, particularly a poisoned one, and spam twin fangs just as frequently as an adc would spam AAs. all the while you have to keep moving to spread the distance between the target to keep them kited.

in short the comparison was less about the role, and more about the mechanics of her particular kit.

am i the only one who read the last four comments and became incredibly dumbfounded.

Quote from raikaria »

Lane: He'll lose straight-up brawls with anyone.

Midgame- Where he's strongest. Still loses streight-up 1v1 duels with any ADC

Lategame - Weakest point really, his damage is very low for an ADC. AP's still explode him.

 

Simply, either force him into all-out duels early, or draw out the game to late.

 

Hard initiate also works wonders. Like it does against all poke/kite.

^^

this is why i don't understand the fascination with this build nowadays. it's one that works in very specific situations (2v1s, poke comp, teams that have additional ad damage, initiators without insta-gap-closers). but it's not something you're supposed to do all the time in general. it's weak in lane since you have to build resource items like spirit stone and tear (so any adc with doran's blade and a bf sword will murder you), and it falls off late since, well, iceborn gauntlet is a core item and it doesn't provide late-game power (As opposed to, say, phantom dancer or I.E.). 

but yeah pretty much what this guy said.

Quote from Kinaro »

Sona is problematic because her perceived power is not nearly as high as her real power. That's because you don't feel much from stat boosts like auras, but they are extremely strong -> weak design.

 

i can understand that, however, how is something that's based on perception warrant any alteration of the champion? 

never mind the fact that sona has definitive weaknesses that can be taken advantage of (namely dat squishiness/no escape). sona appears like a relatively balanced champion who's abilities don't need any touching whatsoever.