What do you like about Ichors?

  • My general thinking is that Ichors, while kind of imba atm, are important distinctions from Summoner's Rift. (opinion: i think by definition, all 'alternate maps' items should be treated as a cool lever that can be used to help identify the map they're on - feel me?)

    We could easily 'nerf' them by just removing them and replacing them with Elixirs, but it's a clear thread through my lurking that TT players like their map being 'SR Kinda' and not just SR Lite.

    I'll be pretty up-front and say i'm interested in removing the Resource Regen from Blue Ichor altogether. Structure DMG (while probably OP) is at least interesting to me in that it calls for a specific action once you take it - Resource Regen is like 'I wanna fight...maybe? Maybe i just want to stall forever.' When the map already has a global chalice aura, it gets difficult for me to justify Ziggs Potion as an item.

    tl;dr
    -gauging if TT players enjoy the secondary 'map-only' effects ichors give or if they just want reg. elixirs
    -looking to replace blue ichor's effect with something more defining/actionable, and hopefully more balanceable than stallfest ZiggsPot
    -bonus round: if players feel RagePot is too unsatisfying, Structure DMG could become something else

    that's kind of where my head's at atm - this is purely ideation phase, so don't worry - not the end of the world! would like to get Ichor changes relatively soon into an upcoming patch tho, so speak up if y'all got thoughts!
  • Hey y'all -

    I'd like to make some balance changes to Ichors on TT. I have a few ideas, but before i pull any triggers i want to hear from the community what you particularly like about them.

    I know this question is kinda vague, but i'd like to understand what you guys want ichors to do, and if you find them at all interesting.

    I'll hold off from posting my thoughts for a bit and give y'all some time to discuss.
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by exec3 View Post
    Brings memories of Priscilla's Blessing which was eventually removed for being problematic. I don't think it's a good direction as you probably shouldn't be trying to capture altars alone as a mage and as a team unless the extra speed capture is unfairly quick it won't be noticeable.
    Priscilla's as i recall (and this is my opinion) was problematic due to the primary incentive being backdooring - which for dominion especially is a form of non-interaction that feels pretty bad.

    If you're being backdoored on SR, there are often other methods to overcome this (force a teamfight 4v5, use a teleport to cover the tower, trade towers or baron etc) but in Dominion almost none of these are possible. Questionably forcing teamfights, but on a very open map it's hard to find choke-points to engage (or much less scarce, actual objectives to fight over).

    I do think Priscilla's Blessing -might- have worked if there was an item that did it for every class - but in the end, the play it promoted as well as the lack of decisions around it (you will never not get it if you can) made it more trouble than it was worth.

    Something like 50/100% Altar cap bonus on a consumable item however gives a couple of differences around it.

    1. Unlike PB, the threat is not ever-present. Its finite duration and risk/reward factor inherent to elixirs make it such that the opponent would have to cap an altar to make their money back - taking action. PB was just like 'lemme get this for the stats and if they ever make a play i'll react by backdooring' While it's possible to pop an ichor and keep one in your inventory...you're spending a ton of resources on the gamble of Altar Control (and not real items, mind you).

    Similarly, Altars are not both the sole win condition and sole objective on the map - Capture points are.

    Those are my thoughts as to why it might be cool to contemplate. The bigger question in my mind is not 'is sneaking altars on a map with no vision but high focus on risk/reward strategic movements cool at all?' but rather 'is it a good thing for Syndra to sneak that altar when drawing you 1v1 is what she wants?'
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by Thales View Post
    It's a really interesting idea, but much like the current Muramana, it seems wildly variable in power. One of the nice things about the "generic" ichors and elixers is that they don't serve as a differentiator. It's not like some champs are rendered unviable because they get outcompeted by folks who can utilize blue ichor.

    I actually find this interesting - as everything that i've seen so far (Ziggs, Cassi, Syndra, etc) being not just viable but frustrating at high elo is related to how good they are with Blue Ichor.

    Unlike SR, where 1-2 Blue buffs is the max, champions on TT can double or triple-up on Blue Buffs - and they're strong enough stat-wise that it's actually not a huge loss to keep an ichor up. Factor in that the AP, CDR, and Regen are strong enough to sustain farming, these champions often not only stall and crush fights, but break even or better due to the strength of the pot (allowing them to chain them in a stall situation).

    With that in mind, i think it's actually a -huge- differentiator. Mages that are good at Ichor are put over the top while those that aren't are kind of hovering around 'just okay'.

    The above is just my opinion on how i see the problem, and why i'd like to not just remove the Resource Regen from blue ichor, but find a TT-Unique 'affix' that makes it stand out among just 'a ball of stats'.

    New silly idea: What about %Altar Capture Bonus?
  • Crazy idea - what if Blue Ichor made your spells cost more mana, but made them do more damage? (Opt-in muramana, essentially - downside being there would be no toggle) Could be magic-'d to make it such that the bonus resource cost/bonus damage only factored into champions.