I was playing TT competitively for a few weeks before the switch, and managed to get to gold. I've been enjoying several aspects of the new map, but have noticed that ranged champions have even less of a place now.
Bruisers also have a HUGE advantage over ranged units because there are no wards. This makes it impossible to gain vision around corners without walking around them, or having an item taking up a slot with very poor stats (grez'z or sweeper). This is making ranged champions who need vision useless in fights that take place in the jungle, which is 90% of where the action is. I can understand that wards might become far too powerful a tool for map control, by making it impossible to press for objectives with very little money.
Solution: Wards won't work. With two wards on that map, you can completely zone out the potential for any aggressive play. However, having a consumable that has the same duration grez's lantern with the same area, range and effect as their pink and green ward counter parts would solve this. It would still take up a slot, but the investment would be far lower, and not be on a one minute cooldown.
Also, one of the problems with BotRK is that it's range is too small to be used effectively on most ranged champions. Melee champions get much more out of the item because they don't have to put themselves out of position to use it aggressively. Perhaps extend the range of the item to match the aa range of ranged champions, similarly to Trist's e?
There's some truth in what he says. The League community actually is pretty good about buying transitories and consumables. It was a big design challenge in HoN/DotA to get players excited about warding and dusting. That's actually the biggest concern with a consumable reveal... there's a lot less clear satisfaction behind using the item. It's like a failed CV; it's very binary, and while knowing where your opponent isn't is useful, it doesn't feel as good.
All I can say for now is that it's a recognized issue, and we're looking into a whole host of different solutions for it.
I'm curious, would it be OP to add an effect similar to The Lightbringer's passive to Grez's and return it to the Sweeper?
for those that don't know, on Dominion Lightbringer and Sweeper have passives that grant vision of your target for a few seconds, on regular attacks for Lightbringer, and Spells for Sweeper, making it easier to stick to people that would try and bush juke or stealth escape
I dislike this effect because it removes gameplay (no juking, can't stealth, etc). League doesn't tend to do stealth-bundling; what I mean by this is that stealth is usually a standalone effect. So if you take away the stealth aspect, that champion generally is completely vulnerable (I generally don't like this from a design aspect). The only exception here (AFAIK) is Twitch, whose stealth is bundled with a movement speed bonus. The "dumb vision" tagging on Lightbringer and the old Hextech Sweeper was a necessity back in the day of long-term strategic stealths, but since we've done away with all of those, I want to phase them out. Lightbringer will remain in Dominion for now, because Dominion is a very different atmosphere, but don't expect them to return to TT.
Akali : MR/Armor
Shaco : Flash
Twitch : MS/AS Boost
Eve : MP5
Talon : MS boost
Kha'Zix : MS boost (+possible reduced damage)
Teemo : AS boost
Vayne : bonus AD
Wukong : 70/115/160/205/250 magic damage
...
did I miss any? or did I misunderstand the bundle?
Sorry, it was very poorly worded. I was thinking more of long-term stealths... which we don't have anymore other than Eve, so yeah. Disregard what I said
Way to bring ranged champs back into TT
Bruisers also have a HUGE advantage over ranged units because there are no wards. This makes it impossible to gain vision around corners without walking around them, or having an item taking up a slot with very poor stats (grez'z or sweeper). This is making ranged champions who need vision useless in fights that take place in the jungle, which is 90% of where the action is. I can understand that wards might become far too powerful a tool for map control, by making it impossible to press for objectives with very little money.
Solution: Wards won't work. With two wards on that map, you can completely zone out the potential for any aggressive play. However, having a consumable that has the same duration grez's lantern with the same area, range and effect as their pink and green ward counter parts would solve this. It would still take up a slot, but the investment would be far lower, and not be on a one minute cooldown.
Also, one of the problems with BotRK is that it's range is too small to be used effectively on most ranged champions. Melee champions get much more out of the item because they don't have to put themselves out of position to use it aggressively. Perhaps extend the range of the item to match the aa range of ranged champions, similarly to Trist's e?
All I can say for now is that it's a recognized issue, and we're looking into a whole host of different solutions for it.
for those that don't know, on Dominion Lightbringer and Sweeper have passives that grant vision of your target for a few seconds, on regular attacks for Lightbringer, and Spells for Sweeper, making it easier to stick to people that would try and bush juke or stealth escape
Shaco : Flash
Twitch : MS/AS Boost
Eve : MP5
Talon : MS boost
Kha'Zix : MS boost (+possible reduced damage)
Teemo : AS boost
Vayne : bonus AD
Wukong : 70/115/160/205/250 magic damage
...
did I miss any? or did I misunderstand the bundle?