Reign of Gaming

Originally Posted by IronStylus

I'll respond, but I agree with the fact that the thread's beginning doesn't have the most positive tone. I normally don't respond to negativity, but I have some thoughts here. Most of the other comments are fairly positive, so I'll address you rather than the original points and some others I've seen. Thanks for being calm and positive bee tee dubs.

This is an interesting point.

Whilst a muscular lady would probably be default badass, not all badass ladies have to be muscular. With the case of Vi, yes, as I've said, we could've added some bulk, but that's such a subtle change on the geometry level that it's mostly unnoticeable unless you're at model viewer level, and, as you might know from playing the game, we aren't. We're not FPS, we're RTS. The way that Vi's gauntlets are positioned isn't really helped in any way by bulking her up. I like the Calhoon reference from Wreck it Ralph, I think she's an awesome design, and made me think a lot of Vi when I saw the movie, in a good way. However, maybe it's just me, but Vi's youth I feel takes precedence over bulk, and I don't think the youth aspect is served too well by excessive bulk. Thick/thin contrast is what's used here. I think she's fine in that regard. Again, for our camera, for our game, such a subtle geo tweak wouldn't be noticeable and we'd be doing such an adjustment for our own artistic satisfaction rather than the ultimate goal, game readability and clarity for our camera.

I've also said this, more musculature and bulked up anatomy would better suited for a character that's really going to show it off, rather than a character who's primary reads obstruct any added anatomy we might want to add. Better to spend the time and utilize the real estate on a character where you're actually going to notice.. Sejuani would be a good example.

We've learned an interesting tidbit as we've made over a hundred champions. There are different levels of stylization that fit for different character tiers. Female stylization tends to be in the zone where style, anatomy, etc can be pushed. That doesn't mean we limit body-types, we admittedly need more, but if you historically look at a lot of champions, the females are served by more conventional "realistic" body types, the males less so, the humanoids even less, the yordles are super stylized, and the creatures are crazy-go-nuts. If we were to break down female body stylization it might go something like: Athletic female, standard female, voluptuous female, heroic female, brutish female. Examples: Akali, Diana, Miss Fortune, Leona, ______. You might notice the blank. We really don't have the latter, or anything really in it's realm. We have male hulks like Mundo or Scion, but nothing analogous in our females. If I were to throw Vi into one of those areas it'd probably be somewhere between athletic and standard, on the young side. Calhoon would probably be heroic. Mind you that's a very, very, generalized breakdown.

All that said, badass ladies are not always going to be muscular. If they're a harrier of sorts they'll be athletic. If they're tanky they might be more heroic. There was no real intent to stick Vi into a particular slot, she just evolved into her space, that's usually how good character design goes. You don't try to design for the type, you design and the type evolves. Vi could be pushed and pulled here and there but that's splitting hairs I feel. If we make a barbaric Monster Hunter type female then by all means we probably want something closer to brutish and more heavilly stylized. Certain tropes have been tagged by the team which would be ripe for this treatment. Depending on role however, the standard may prevail and clothing, weapon, and sources of power might swap.

Make no mistake, I've had my hand in clawing for us to make more distinct body types, but even when I work on something, as I recently did, it was a better choice to show agility rather than raw muscle because of the role. If we design by role and by what's best for the character, we achieve variety so long as we imagine broadly inside of that role. That's where I feel we should focus our efforts. Not for making an effort to find space for something particular, but for letting a character's development dictate our visual problem solving. Believe me, I've had an eagle's eye on opportunities where we can vary body types, though I haven't as of yet personally worked on anything to ground-breaking.

For future reference, try phrasing and creating threads that push the positive nature of the discussion. I don't fall into the habit of addressing negativity, but I've made an exception here.

Originally Posted by IronStylus

It's 4:32 in the morning. This discussion is about anything I want it to be!

Like.. potatoes, toilet paper, ruthless killer birds with an affinity for girls in armor, GO!

Originally Posted by IronStylus

Combo attacks, huh? The mark and the followup? The tag and the hit? The eye and the arrow? The sight and the strike? The call and the bite? The hand and the claw? The bond and the blow?

I like where this is going.

Originally Posted by IronStylus

Braviary, obviously =)