Every single game I play people just scream report for ANYTHING and EVERYTHING now.
Lose lane = Report
Get outplay = Report
Die and give out first blood = OH THAT A REPORT
Lose a team fight = Better report that too
Have a bad game = Report him, he is a troll.
Team gets caught and your clearing a big wave top = REPORT THAT TROLL
Ask team to group up = STFU reported
Ask team to buy wards = STFU reported
Jungle and teammate loses lane = REPORT TROLL JUNGLE
Every game is absolutely miserable. Spending half your time defending yourself against ppl screaming report, especially these people that sit in all chat asking the other team to false report players.
Ranked is 100x worse then normal, there is always 1-2 people that cannot accept they get outplayed and lost and look for a scapegoat and scream report as loud as they can. Thats my idea of logging on and enjoy a GAME, spending 40 minutes trying to defend myself against these raging report spammers.
Edit : I appreciate the response from Lyte and the people adding to the discussion.
Edit :
Lyte -
I am not talking about the effectiveness of the tribunal, I am talking about what the tribunal has done to the in game experience.
Granted the tribunal removes toxic players from the game, but after 3 years of playing League I see VERY little difference in toxic players (probably because I only play ranked).
The problem the tribunal has created is another form of trolling, REPORT for everything. Regardless of the chances of being banned by said reports, it makes people pretty FRUSTRATED having to deal with these all game long and for ANY reason what-so-ever.
I would rather listen to some kid rage type all day then have to sit there and listen to someone say "report XXXX for XXXX" after every mistake , EVERY GAME. (Especially losing games it becomes 100x worse.)
How is this any different the someone rage at you? In my opinion it has been more damaging to the game experience then anything else. Not only do you have to do with the same trolls , ragers, afk'ers, feeder that have been around for years, but now you have to spend all your time in game defending yourself from these report bullies non stop. You may not get banned for the reports, but its STILL ON YOUR MIND, and that ruins the game experience.
the list goes on and on....
Also don't forget the gang mentality of duo que'ers and group que'ers, the berate you all game and if you say anything back you are just dog piled and harassed to death while eating a number of reports.
Everyone in this thread, take a serious look at your match history.
How many games had a true intentional feeder going 1-30 or worse? How many games had a Leaver? How many games had a player saying extremely offensive slurs like f*ggot or n*gger?
All of these things are dramatically lower than they were a year ago.
For players that still see a high rate of these behaviors... you are the only common link in your games. You might want to reflect on why a large majority of players don't see the same things you do.
There was one where this guy asked me to kill myself because I lost lane in ranked. I might have played bad but I don't deserve that. When I report someone I don't care how long it takes, I want to know if that guy got punished. I want to know of justice was served. I think a lot of players would feel better of they knew that the guy who spends his time raging in chat got banned or not.
We've been brainstorming a lot about feedback and agree that we could do a better job of letting them know their reports were effective in removing toxicity from the game.
Aside from improving feedback, we're going to do what we can to continue to improve player behavior in 2013. One of our main goals is to try to remove the triggers that cause players to act in the way you mention; alternatively, a second goal is to shield positive players from this toxicity when it inevitably happens in rare situations.
We all know we can never get rid of toxic behavior entirely--that's unrealistic; however, we have come a long way in the past year. It's unfortunate that a lot of toxic players don't believe they are toxic and lack the self-awareness to see how their own behaviors are the triggers of rage in others.
You cannot deny that SOME players have high rates of these things, simply because they have poor luck. Sometimes, I go ten games without a leaver/feeder. Sometimes, I have ten in a row.
Some players definitely have bad luck with toxic behavior; however, I'm referring to players like the OP who clearly show a toxic attitude and even have a name that reflects a toxic attitude. These players then blame the game or other players for toxicity in their games.
How about #1 cause of toxicity? - the champ select? Its also a cause of uneven games as well - as most players are good at only few lanes/roles and when they forced to "fill" they are frustrated right from get go ,which doesnt make them play any better their alreayd weak role
Half the games are raging and thrown before it even starts because people cant agree on role in champ select
I know Riot doesnt want "enforce" meta. But if you do matchmaking by lanes -there is no meta enforced. There are 3 lanes and jungle. 2 solo lanes and one duo. - thats not meta that basic rule of the game
You can go bruisers bot, ad carry mid and so on and so forth. What doesnt change is taht there is 3 lanes to be filled and jungle. Playing solo long lane is different from duo lane or short lane or jungle
I agree, Champ Select is one of the biggest problems in the game today when it comes to player behavior. We have a few ideas we're brainstorming on related to this, but don't have enough to talk about yet.
I gave a suggestion at the end of the post. Go play 10 matches and tell me how many of them have at least one toxic player.
I'm also not a Lead Designer of Social Systems, but if I was, I sure wouldn't pawn the blame off on players complaining about a flawed system.
If you interpreted my post as pawning blame on the players, that's my fault and I apologize. Player behavior is a collaboration between Riot and the community and that's the main point I wanted to make--we're all responsible. It's not just up to us as developers of the game, and it's not just up to the players who want to enjoy the game.
You play Ranked a lot, and I've admitted a few times that Ranked is nowhere where it needs to be--we still have an extremely long way to go in Ranked when it comes to player behavior.
I also agree that "report" is often used as a threat, but I've mentioned before that very few players actually follow through and report--the average player right now only gets reported about 5 times in 100 games. That's a pretty low number and surprised even us. Without the Tribunal, Honor, LeaverBuster and all of these other player behavior features, we actually saw a pretty high number of games with intentional feeding (extreme examples like 1-30), AFK/Leaving, and rampant use of racial slurs and similarly offensive language. These have gone down, but we certainly do see a fair number of players use "report" to threaten and bully others.
Ever since the player behavior team was formed, we've also been extremely open with data around systems like the Tribunal. Some players in this thread may not realize that every single Reform Card case on NA is still openly available and can be downloaded for analysis. Numerous players have aggregated hundreds of thousands of Tribunal cases and crunched the data and they all come to the same conclusion we do--the Tribunal works pretty darn well for removing or reforming the most toxic players in the game.
Is the Tribunal perfect? Of course not. No system is ever perfect. However, we're at a point with the Tribunal that we believe that we can get better gains working on other systems like further improving the Honor Initiative, LeaverBuster, and maybe even entirely new systems down the road.
Good what? My opinion holds the same weight as yours. I say the tribunal doesn't work, you say it does. That brings us to an inspection of the facts and data. But oh wait... Lyte purposely holds back virtually all data from the tribunal because he knows this. Therefore it becomes an argument of opinions which makes any criticism impossible.
Lyte is a ******. Hiding information for the sake of deception is a dick move.
Actually, since the player behavior team was formed, almost all of the Tribunal data is readily available. You can download every single Tribunal case on NA right now and crunch the numbers if you like.
Numerous players have downloaded all the Tribunal case data and can figure out exactly how well the Tribunal is doing. They also all concluded that the Tribunal is working pretty well.
I'm the first person to say the Tribunal isn't perfect. I've said it many, many times. However, it does work pretty well and I've been happy to see players analyze all the data and come to the same conclusions.
Typical excuse of Tribunal defenders. What if a player that rages very rarely gets reported several times by random trolls and the game he raged appears on Tribunal? I've seen too many cases with one game.
If a player rages rarely, it's nearly impossible to end up in the Tribunal. This is because we understand that players are human, and we all have our bad days--we don't expect everyone to be perfectly behaved in 100% of their games. The Tribunal only targets consistently negative players.
Getting reported several times by random trolls cannot send you to the Tribunal either. Troll reports are automatically filtered and don't count towards a player's Tribunal eligibility.
This player having had accounts in tribunal, suspended/warned and banned makes another account and with a report rate of 3.2+ reports per game, manages to get 135 games played prior to being punished.
Just to clarify, this player's account was permabanned and punished 5 times during the 135 game stretch. I agree this is still too slow, but I wanted to clarify that it wasn't 135 games until his first punishment.
Players at the upper tiers of punishment also require Player Support reviews, so they tend to be able to squeeze in extra games while we're reviewing the final punishments.
Congrats Lyte, The tribunal has literally made the community 10x worse.
Lose lane = Report
Get outplay = Report
Die and give out first blood = OH THAT A REPORT
Lose a team fight = Better report that too
Have a bad game = Report him, he is a troll.
Team gets caught and your clearing a big wave top = REPORT THAT TROLL
Ask team to group up = STFU reported
Ask team to buy wards = STFU reported
Jungle and teammate loses lane = REPORT TROLL JUNGLE
Every game is absolutely miserable. Spending half your time defending yourself against ppl screaming report, especially these people that sit in all chat asking the other team to false report players.
Ranked is 100x worse then normal, there is always 1-2 people that cannot accept they get outplayed and lost and look for a scapegoat and scream report as loud as they can. Thats my idea of logging on and enjoy a GAME, spending 40 minutes trying to defend myself against these raging report spammers.
Edit : I appreciate the response from Lyte and the people adding to the discussion.
Edit :
Lyte -
I am not talking about the effectiveness of the tribunal, I am talking about what the tribunal has done to the in game experience.
Granted the tribunal removes toxic players from the game, but after 3 years of playing League I see VERY little difference in toxic players (probably because I only play ranked).
The problem the tribunal has created is another form of trolling, REPORT for everything. Regardless of the chances of being banned by said reports, it makes people pretty FRUSTRATED having to deal with these all game long and for ANY reason what-so-ever.
I would rather listen to some kid rage type all day then have to sit there and listen to someone say "report XXXX for XXXX" after every mistake , EVERY GAME. (Especially losing games it becomes 100x worse.)
How is this any different the someone rage at you? In my opinion it has been more damaging to the game experience then anything else. Not only do you have to do with the same trolls , ragers, afk'ers, feeder that have been around for years, but now you have to spend all your time in game defending yourself from these report bullies non stop. You may not get banned for the reports, but its STILL ON YOUR MIND, and that ruins the game experience.
the list goes on and on....
Also don't forget the gang mentality of duo que'ers and group que'ers, the berate you all game and if you say anything back you are just dog piled and harassed to death while eating a number of reports.
How many games had a true intentional feeder going 1-30 or worse? How many games had a Leaver? How many games had a player saying extremely offensive slurs like f*ggot or n*gger?
All of these things are dramatically lower than they were a year ago.
For players that still see a high rate of these behaviors... you are the only common link in your games. You might want to reflect on why a large majority of players don't see the same things you do.
Aside from improving feedback, we're going to do what we can to continue to improve player behavior in 2013. One of our main goals is to try to remove the triggers that cause players to act in the way you mention; alternatively, a second goal is to shield positive players from this toxicity when it inevitably happens in rare situations.
We all know we can never get rid of toxic behavior entirely--that's unrealistic; however, we have come a long way in the past year. It's unfortunate that a lot of toxic players don't believe they are toxic and lack the self-awareness to see how their own behaviors are the triggers of rage in others.
Half the games are raging and thrown before it even starts because people cant agree on role in champ select
I know Riot doesnt want "enforce" meta. But if you do matchmaking by lanes -there is no meta enforced. There are 3 lanes and jungle. 2 solo lanes and one duo. - thats not meta that basic rule of the game
You can go bruisers bot, ad carry mid and so on and so forth. What doesnt change is taht there is 3 lanes to be filled and jungle. Playing solo long lane is different from duo lane or short lane or jungle
I'm also not a Lead Designer of Social Systems, but if I was, I sure wouldn't pawn the blame off on players complaining about a flawed system.
You play Ranked a lot, and I've admitted a few times that Ranked is nowhere where it needs to be--we still have an extremely long way to go in Ranked when it comes to player behavior.
I also agree that "report" is often used as a threat, but I've mentioned before that very few players actually follow through and report--the average player right now only gets reported about 5 times in 100 games. That's a pretty low number and surprised even us. Without the Tribunal, Honor, LeaverBuster and all of these other player behavior features, we actually saw a pretty high number of games with intentional feeding (extreme examples like 1-30), AFK/Leaving, and rampant use of racial slurs and similarly offensive language. These have gone down, but we certainly do see a fair number of players use "report" to threaten and bully others.
Ever since the player behavior team was formed, we've also been extremely open with data around systems like the Tribunal. Some players in this thread may not realize that every single Reform Card case on NA is still openly available and can be downloaded for analysis. Numerous players have aggregated hundreds of thousands of Tribunal cases and crunched the data and they all come to the same conclusion we do--the Tribunal works pretty darn well for removing or reforming the most toxic players in the game.
Is the Tribunal perfect? Of course not. No system is ever perfect. However, we're at a point with the Tribunal that we believe that we can get better gains working on other systems like further improving the Honor Initiative, LeaverBuster, and maybe even entirely new systems down the road.
Lyte is a ******. Hiding information for the sake of deception is a dick move.
Numerous players have downloaded all the Tribunal case data and can figure out exactly how well the Tribunal is doing. They also all concluded that the Tribunal is working pretty well.
I'm the first person to say the Tribunal isn't perfect. I've said it many, many times. However, it does work pretty well and I've been happy to see players analyze all the data and come to the same conclusions.
Getting reported several times by random trolls cannot send you to the Tribunal either. Troll reports are automatically filtered and don't count towards a player's Tribunal eligibility.
Players at the upper tiers of punishment also require Player Support reviews, so they tend to be able to squeeze in extra games while we're reviewing the final punishments.