Please don't make any more mech skins for awhile, I'm sure I'm not alone in my boredom of mech based skins. We know you guys are capable of other things than mech (just like you were capable of things outside of fire). We don't inherently HATE these things, it's just tiresome to get DROVES of the same thing. Please space things out better x.x
Actually, so here's my thoughts. This is actually not about sci-fi/mech/robot skins. This is, like you note, actually about cadence.
One thing we shouldn't do is because we may have a glut now, is to stop internally ideating on a cool idea, robotic or not. That's how we get into these sort of ruts. We say, "OH! COOL IDEA! LET'S MAKE A LOT!" Then.. when we found out maybe we have saturation, we say.. "OH SNAP! TOO MUCH! BETTER STOP MAKING THEM!" Then.. inexorably.. another theme comes along and we wear that a little thin, then over correct again.
So, the solution is actually to keep making anything cool we want to make. If there's a champion that would look awesome in a sci-fi treatment then we should make that happen. Maybe we backlog it, maybe we put it on slow burn, but we should make it. However, the key is to make a whole lot of other things in tandem and stagger them. Then we don't have fire, fire, fire, frost, frost, frost, robot, robot, robot, silly, silly silly. We need something resembling fire, silly, frost, robot, etc. That ultimately is about planning and cadence. That's where my concern and efforts lie. Helping with cadence, not limiting our menu of ideas.
Oh by no means do I want them stopped all together. Having some more flavour within the meantime of a mech release would do WONDERS for making things feel far more awesome. And I mean, not creating something because you're told "we have too many" is also a waste of a potentially good idea, and if it's a good idea it SHOULD be done, right?
I concur with you in pretty much every aspect. Just as long as we don't get another random set of ideas of the same thing for 2-3 months.
I had another question about the art design in league-- in that the level of "tech" even in classic/basic skins seems to be ramping up a lot faster.
Consider the differences between people like Caitlyn and Vi. They're from the same place, Caitlyn is supposed to be equipped with state-of-the-art techmaturgical equipment for her job but Vi is running around with homemade power fists and a shield generator while Caitlyn is throwing bear traps. :x The art style/level of technology on a lot of heroes I feel is starting to get to a point where older "inventor/tech-fancy" heroes seemingly feel low-tech and kinda barbaric in comparison. Heimer is supposed to be the revered inventor, but Viktor's everything feels centuries ahead of anything Heimer has. Caitlyn is supposed to be the sheriff of the Victorian City of Progress but is using an old rifle and bear traps as Jayce and Vi are jumping around a techno-megatropolis which is supposed to be the same city in Caitlyn's splash art.
I feel there's a lot of really weird discontinuity of setting starting to take shape in League.
:x I guess I feel like Riot has had a lot of chances to get release cadence right, and no matter how many times the team seems to recognize it, they seem to simply make the same sort of patterns in other facets of the game.
Oh, and will we get Piltover Vice Caitlyn/Vi skins? ?
This is very interesting, I'm impressed you're aware of the trend. That's not meant to be condescending, I'm having trouble framing the statement, but I'm happy people are noticing that things are evolving.
You're right. Technology that's being introduced into our world currently is straying away from what we might have had back in the day. I'd roughly separate out these types of styles and tech levels as "traditional fantasy" and "modern fantasy." That is to say, what we have in some areas is quite literally medieval technology and aesthetics. Some of the older Demacian champions for example, things that might have been influenced by the Warcraft-type armor sets which defined a lot of traditional video game fantasy. Similarly the Piltover champions that you mention, Caitlyn vs Jayce, excellent examples.
Traditional fantasy is something we're probably moving away from. Patchwork cloth and big shoulder pads. We'll have those, but we have to find the right way to make them feel uniquely "League". Right now we're finding our stride with how we want to portray our world and how everything from manufacturing techniques to types of clothing people wear is becoming clearer to us. We're doing that with newer characters.
In relation to "high" technology, we probably want to push towards what we're seeing in characters like Jayce, a "functional magic" if you will. Something that isn't defined by scientific reality, but offers a way to power our more fanciful devices and abilities. The aspect of the "raw" versus "functional" magic is something that you might compare different factions with. Arcane magic of someone like Swain versus functional magic of someone like Vi. Theres a framing happening in each of them. One is the more traditional fantasy of spells, transformation, other arcane sorts of feel. The other is one that's significantly more functional, that's inside of something, powering it, making it live.
This all presents opportunities and challenges. The opportunity is that we really get to nail down how our universe should coalesce. If we're going to put out a new Demacian champion for example, that champion would probably embrace more of a functional aspect. If there is magic, it's not as dark or raw as Noxian magic, nor is it as refined as Piltover hex-tech. It would be something that has a feeling of power, and "good", but funneled in a way which is complementary to Demacia. The challenge is that we have to find ways to bring the more standard and new forms of magic representation into some of our older champions to bring them in line with what we're continuing to develop.
All factions have some sort of magic obviously, that's ya know.. fantasy.. but it's going to take different forms for each faction and each champion depending how they want to wield it.
Somehow, the forces of Freljord, Demacia, Piltover, Noxus, Zaun, and any other city-state have to be able to go toe-to-toe with each other, using the inherent strengths they posses and how they choose to use or not use the magic that permeates Valoran.
How do you explain Steel Legion Lux then? I mean i usually love what you make, but that skin just looks...bad, the splash is nice, the in game model is...gross. And why wont you answer any of the Lux fan made threads questioning this issue?
I'm not going to have any huge effect on assuaging fears or calming tempers by contributing to the conversation while the skin is still unreleased.
Thank you so much for stating this out, Stylus. I used to think Riot has forgotten the world-building of League.
I was mildly relieved to see that both Syndra and Zed have the Asian/Japanese background in their Ionian origins kept. Seeing your idea about how the next Demacian character should be, though~I have no idea what to expect.
As it is, the presence of new Demacian and Noxian champions is severely lacking
Seeing how Caitlyn has received no visual uppdate at all after Vi's release...I have to emphasize that talk is cheap. We need to see plans and progress, if you have any
These issues are what is really important to some fans. You might want to polish these old things first before attempting to release more new stuffs
Hmm.. yeah. We could use some more Demacian champions. Damacia needs heroes.
As for Caitlyn, she's not a high priority on relaunches. She could use a fidelity upgrade, and maybe a "modernization" but that wasn't feasible to do before Vi released. Also, I can't give plans and progress in most circumstances. That's the nature of the beast. Talk is actually expensive when it ruins people's expectations or sets us up for failure. We don't want to talk about what's still in flux.
Steel Legion Shyvana
One thing we shouldn't do is because we may have a glut now, is to stop internally ideating on a cool idea, robotic or not. That's how we get into these sort of ruts. We say, "OH! COOL IDEA! LET'S MAKE A LOT!" Then.. when we found out maybe we have saturation, we say.. "OH SNAP! TOO MUCH! BETTER STOP MAKING THEM!" Then.. inexorably.. another theme comes along and we wear that a little thin, then over correct again.
So, the solution is actually to keep making anything cool we want to make. If there's a champion that would look awesome in a sci-fi treatment then we should make that happen. Maybe we backlog it, maybe we put it on slow burn, but we should make it. However, the key is to make a whole lot of other things in tandem and stagger them. Then we don't have fire, fire, fire, frost, frost, frost, robot, robot, robot, silly, silly silly. We need something resembling fire, silly, frost, robot, etc. That ultimately is about planning and cadence. That's where my concern and efforts lie. Helping with cadence, not limiting our menu of ideas.
I concur with you in pretty much every aspect. Just as long as we don't get another random set of ideas of the same thing for 2-3 months.
2012 Never Forget
Consider the differences between people like Caitlyn and Vi. They're from the same place, Caitlyn is supposed to be equipped with state-of-the-art techmaturgical equipment for her job but Vi is running around with homemade power fists and a shield generator while Caitlyn is throwing bear traps. :x The art style/level of technology on a lot of heroes I feel is starting to get to a point where older "inventor/tech-fancy" heroes seemingly feel low-tech and kinda barbaric in comparison. Heimer is supposed to be the revered inventor, but Viktor's everything feels centuries ahead of anything Heimer has. Caitlyn is supposed to be the sheriff of the Victorian City of Progress but is using an old rifle and bear traps as Jayce and Vi are jumping around a techno-megatropolis which is supposed to be the same city in Caitlyn's splash art.
I feel there's a lot of really weird discontinuity of setting starting to take shape in League.
:x I guess I feel like Riot has had a lot of chances to get release cadence right, and no matter how many times the team seems to recognize it, they seem to simply make the same sort of patterns in other facets of the game.
Oh, and will we get Piltover Vice Caitlyn/Vi skins?
You're right. Technology that's being introduced into our world currently is straying away from what we might have had back in the day. I'd roughly separate out these types of styles and tech levels as "traditional fantasy" and "modern fantasy." That is to say, what we have in some areas is quite literally medieval technology and aesthetics. Some of the older Demacian champions for example, things that might have been influenced by the Warcraft-type armor sets which defined a lot of traditional video game fantasy. Similarly the Piltover champions that you mention, Caitlyn vs Jayce, excellent examples.
Traditional fantasy is something we're probably moving away from. Patchwork cloth and big shoulder pads. We'll have those, but we have to find the right way to make them feel uniquely "League". Right now we're finding our stride with how we want to portray our world and how everything from manufacturing techniques to types of clothing people wear is becoming clearer to us. We're doing that with newer characters.
In relation to "high" technology, we probably want to push towards what we're seeing in characters like Jayce, a "functional magic" if you will. Something that isn't defined by scientific reality, but offers a way to power our more fanciful devices and abilities. The aspect of the "raw" versus "functional" magic is something that you might compare different factions with. Arcane magic of someone like Swain versus functional magic of someone like Vi. Theres a framing happening in each of them. One is the more traditional fantasy of spells, transformation, other arcane sorts of feel. The other is one that's significantly more functional, that's inside of something, powering it, making it live.
This all presents opportunities and challenges. The opportunity is that we really get to nail down how our universe should coalesce. If we're going to put out a new Demacian champion for example, that champion would probably embrace more of a functional aspect. If there is magic, it's not as dark or raw as Noxian magic, nor is it as refined as Piltover hex-tech. It would be something that has a feeling of power, and "good", but funneled in a way which is complementary to Demacia. The challenge is that we have to find ways to bring the more standard and new forms of magic representation into some of our older champions to bring them in line with what we're continuing to develop.
All factions have some sort of magic obviously, that's ya know.. fantasy.. but it's going to take different forms for each faction and each champion depending how they want to wield it.
Somehow, the forces of Freljord, Demacia, Piltover, Noxus, Zaun, and any other city-state have to be able to go toe-to-toe with each other, using the inherent strengths they posses and how they choose to use or not use the magic that permeates Valoran.
I was mildly relieved to see that both Syndra and Zed have the Asian/Japanese background in their Ionian origins kept. Seeing your idea about how the next Demacian character should be, though~I have no idea what to expect.
As it is, the presence of new Demacian and Noxian champions is severely lacking
Seeing how Caitlyn has received no visual uppdate at all after Vi's release...I have to emphasize that talk is cheap. We need to see plans and progress, if you have any
These issues are what is really important to some fans. You might want to polish these old things first before attempting to release more new stuffs
As for Caitlyn, she's not a high priority on relaunches. She could use a fidelity upgrade, and maybe a "modernization" but that wasn't feasible to do before Vi released. Also, I can't give plans and progress in most circumstances. That's the nature of the beast. Talk is actually expensive when it ruins people's expectations or sets us up for failure. We don't want to talk about what's still in flux.
Incidentally, was the skin pushed back for any reason? Or did we simply become aware of it FAR earlier then riot had planned?