Edit: And look at that. The 6th Riot post in this thread confirms the development of Dragon Master Swain. Riot's bad?
Just be thankful you never had to deal with OGPlanet, and if you did you'll know what I'm talking about. Riot is excellent compared to them. Riot actually listen to our pleas, which they don't have to do. They also have large contact with the community and take great care of their game. Champions being released in IP? If OGP had the game I don't even think runes would be IP.
They know nothing about game balance.
Nothing about player satisfaction.
No player communications.
Ridiculous pricing and money grubbing events (without as much reward as Riot actually puts out for it).
I dunno. I just think about how bad OGP is whenever somebody complains about Riot and I think to myself they haven't seen a damn thing on how bad this gaming industry really can be.
DO NOT get me started on terrible lore/storyline.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Voidgolem
Riot's not as bad as <Korean Imported MMO Here>.
Pretty much this too. They throw money grubbing events with like 5-10 winners, so you could be spending money for nothing. Not to mention the gacha/gambling systems in most of them that usually leave you with nothing.
I'm going to be honest Morello, I think Riot has gotten slow to react to glaring problems in League. League of Cleavers went on for what, about a week before a patch finally came out to fix it, and yet Zyra got hotfixed in 1-2 days after she was deemed problematic? "We'll be watching this stuff like hawks" I think you yourself said.
Furthermore, it seems that Riot is prone to nerfing problematic issues instead of looking at ways to buff or encourage alternatives. This leads to dominant strategy ruling over League. Things like letting health stacking stay (e.g., nerfing core health items and changing Liandry's to offer less up-front power and more DoT % damage on the PBE) just demonstrates that Riot wants to take things super slowly.
While there's some validity to your larger point, "this thing was imbalanced for a week, and that's a big problem!" makes me laugh a bit - we've got everyone accustomed to Riot time
Slow for us is still really fast overall, though maybe better prioritization or context could help. There's always going to be things individuals disagree with, and it does make sense that it translates into not liking us as an organization sometimes. I don't know if that actually translates into us being "worse," but the impact of everything we do is higher.
No lore, but I hear its all coming together again.
Many player suggested skins ( Void Fizz, Dragon Master Swain) with an outstanding support behind it gone unnoticed.
Is the expectation that we do everything suggested really quickly? =/ I mean that makes sense, but holy moly. I feel like (and this comes with the territory of game development!) that we're only remembering the minority of things not followed up on and not all the player suggestions we've delivered on.
This is a tough area, because we try to view it holistically, but the way people feel matters more than anything. Even if we are doing a good job at something, if no one thinks we are, does it matter? I don't think it really does at that point.
Every single employee at Riot would have to offer their soul to some dark lord to even have a snowballs chance in hell at being 1% of the company Blizzard is. Say what you want about Blizzard cause you might be a bit butthurt from past dealings but they didn't claw their way to the top of the PC gaming world and then proceed to make a throne out of the skulls of competitors without being a truly impressive company. Riot has one mildly impressive game with alot of still glaring issues run on a platform that is a hilarious joke (looking at you adobe air).
Riot is a grand canyon away from Blizzard in terms of being a gaming company.
That's not even remotely how we feel about that That might be how you feel about it, however!
Taking it slower is fine. That's not a problem. Having a patch every 2 weeks and a new Champion every 3-4 weeks is great. The issue I see is that Rioters don't disclose their opinions very often in regards to how balanced the game feels to them or what's being done about it.
I think we do as much as we used to, but three things make this worse:
1) It isn't sufficient because it's buried in forums quickly
2) I don't work directly on game balance anymore, and I'm one of the more vocal designers (so "why this was nerfed by 10%" isn't information I'm dealing with much)
3) Our playerbase has drastically grown, but Riot posts haven't. This means the same level of communication is overall less effective because the ratio and signal-to-noise is decreased.
I'd like to get the core balance guys talking more directly like I used to about the specifics. I do think it helps.
Taking it slower is fine. That's not a problem. Having a patch every 2 weeks and a new Champion every 3-4 weeks is great. The issue I see is that Rioters don't disclose their opinions very often in regards to how balanced the game feels to them or what's being done about it.
I think we do as much as we used to, but three things make this worse:
1) It isn't sufficient because it's buried in forums quickly
2) I don't work directly on game balance anymore, and I'm one of the more vocal designers (so "why this was nerfed by 10%" isn't information I'm dealing with much)
3) Our playerbase has drastically grown, but Riot posts haven't. This means the same level of communication is overall less effective because the ratio and signal-to-noise is decreased.
I'd like to get the core balance guys talking more directly like I used to about the specifics. I do think it helps.
Honest question, and one I've asked you before Morello only to have the thread closed (OP was downvoted). Why didn't you guys feel the need to communicate your desire to have this game become health-oriented before implementing the changes needed to get it there?
I though Xypherous explained his thinking there, and admitted to a need for additional tuning. The fact it's hard for me to find that post might be telling, though
This is what I figured is happening. The original designers need to still have a voice in balance. I work in a consulting firm and when experienced guys lose their voice on projects, you definitely start to see the newer guys mistakes pouring through in packages that we send out.
I can have the voice, I have the authority, but I feel the guys we have understand balance very well. I think we just have less context.
In my day doing direct balance, I probably made even less popular decisions overall, but I tried to provide lots of information where I could. I think that breakdown is a core issue.
For anyone who thinks Riot is bad, you haven't seen anything.
Just be thankful you never had to deal with OGPlanet, and if you did you'll know what I'm talking about. Riot is excellent compared to them. Riot actually listen to our pleas, which they don't have to do. They also have large contact with the community and take great care of their game. Champions being released in IP? If OGP had the game I don't even think runes would be IP.
They know nothing about game balance.
Nothing about player satisfaction.
No player communications.
Ridiculous pricing and money grubbing events (without as much reward as Riot actually puts out for it).
I dunno. I just think about how bad OGP is whenever somebody complains about Riot and I think to myself they haven't seen a damn thing on how bad this gaming industry really can be.
DO NOT get me started on terrible lore/storyline.
EDIT 2:
http://fs.ogplanet.com/ws01/136/0776...9/Event_01.jpg
If that isn't money grubbing with minimal reward I have no clue what is.
Furthermore, it seems that Riot is prone to nerfing problematic issues instead of looking at ways to buff or encourage alternatives. This leads to dominant strategy ruling over League. Things like letting health stacking stay (e.g., nerfing core health items and changing Liandry's to offer less up-front power and more DoT % damage on the PBE) just demonstrates that Riot wants to take things super slowly.
Slow for us is still really fast overall, though maybe better prioritization or context could help. There's always going to be things individuals disagree with, and it does make sense that it translates into not liking us as an organization sometimes. I don't know if that actually translates into us being "worse," but the impact of everything we do is higher.
Many player suggested skins ( Void Fizz, Dragon Master Swain) with an outstanding support behind it gone unnoticed.
This is a tough area, because we try to view it holistically, but the way people feel matters more than anything. Even if we are doing a good job at something, if no one thinks we are, does it matter? I don't think it really does at that point.
Riot is a grand canyon away from Blizzard in terms of being a gaming company.
1) It isn't sufficient because it's buried in forums quickly
2) I don't work directly on game balance anymore, and I'm one of the more vocal designers (so "why this was nerfed by 10%" isn't information I'm dealing with much)
3) Our playerbase has drastically grown, but Riot posts haven't. This means the same level of communication is overall less effective because the ratio and signal-to-noise is decreased.
I'd like to get the core balance guys talking more directly like I used to about the specifics. I do think it helps.
1) It isn't sufficient because it's buried in forums quickly
2) I don't work directly on game balance anymore, and I'm one of the more vocal designers (so "why this was nerfed by 10%" isn't information I'm dealing with much)
3) Our playerbase has drastically grown, but Riot posts haven't. This means the same level of communication is overall less effective because the ratio and signal-to-noise is decreased.
I'd like to get the core balance guys talking more directly like I used to about the specifics. I do think it helps.
In my day doing direct balance, I probably made even less popular decisions overall, but I tried to provide lots of information where I could. I think that breakdown is a core issue.