[4.8] Gameplay Patch Forecast, Lifetime RP Purchase Rewards To Be Revealed This Year, 4.8 Team Builder Bugs, Pixel Poro Minigame

Important: Unofficial PBE Patch Notes for 5/13/2014 - Twisted Treeline Jungle Monsters Changes, Udyr's E Now With a Stun Indicator

[4.8] Live Gameplay Patch Forecast

Originally Posted by Riot (View Original Source)

Hey guys, Jag here again for the 4.8 Patch Forecast. We're trying to rotate the Live Gameplay designers that deliver this each patch so you get to know more of the Balance team, but RiotChun was hard at work on some Kha'Zix changes (more details on that below), so hopefully you'll hear from him or SmashGizmo for 4.9.

As it stands, this may be a light patch because we're working on a few mid/long-term changes that you may not see until 4.9 or later, but we'll do our best to keep you on top of everything we have in flight. When we first started doing these forecasts (not too long ago), we thought we'd just talk about all the challenges we faced in the past and present, but didn't fully consider how long each would take in terms of getting 'right.' This might give a better idea of how we approach design and conception.

1) Because we saw how light 4.8 was in terms of our shorter-term projects, we also took some time to 'modernize' a few champions in the game. There are a lot of challenges to doing this constantly (we can talk about that later), but the ones here were selected for their low impact, high value for players without skewing or being 'halfway' fixes that don't address core issues.

The ones below we're in the process of concepting and ideation, and some are closer than others but they're all at least close enough to talk about:

2) Soraka

Solo lane Soraka is definitely a problem with her easy lane clear and almost infinite harass potential. As with Lulu, we have to ask the question of whether or not we think this is a character that has a play pattern that can provide healthy gameplay as both a support and a mid/top laner. We looked into solutions to just hit Soraka's wave clear, like reducing the Starcall damage done to minions, but overall it's hard to see her having such significant sustained damage through the base values of Starcall, even when she has tankier builds. To that end we may refocus some of the power value of Starcall into utility instead of damage.

3) Feral Flare

We've had a lot of pivots on this item in terms of its purpose and long-term direction. I think the live version more accurately reflects the concept we want it to facilitate - a mid/late game item that has strong scaling for carry/autoattacking champions. We still need to make sure that it fits in, in terms of jungler map interactivity, so we're looking to tweak the item's power level while refining the kill/assist mechanics to further incentivize Feral Flare junglers to at least occasionally leave their camps and pressure lanes.

4) Skarner

We're still working on some changes to help Skarner's stickiness and reduce the snowballiness of his current passive. He probably won't have changes for 4.8, but he's still a high priority we're actively working on. Promise!

5) Kha'zix

The team has been hard at work on finding ways to make Kha'zix's popular evolutions balanced. As a side goal we're trying to make all 4 feel like viable evolutions (at least situationally), but our greater concern is keeping him an interesting Assassin with options for counterplay without giving him too much Fighter-level utility (and the capability to brute force fights like Fighters while finishing the fight quickly like an Assassin). The damage reduction on his evolved Ultimate is one of the big culprits here, as there are no avenues of counterplay against him when he stealths (detect and kill him? run away? He has tools to avoid both!).

6) LeBlanc

Our team is continuing analysis on LeBlanc. Her problems remain the same: she's a high burst, high mobility assassin with low counterplay. However, we're reluctant to totally break down her high points without making sure has ways to meaningfully contribute to her team's success, whether that be through her Mage patterns (i.e. her CC) or her Assassin patterns. The problem right now is her 'core identity' is so tied in with her unbalanced play that extracting one from the other is a bigger challenge.

7) Nidalee

Nidalee has been problematic for some time now. We like seeing comps oriented around poking the enemy, but the onslaught of life-or-death projectiles that Nidalee can throw at enemy teams in the mid/late game, particularly when she's built some cooldown reduction, is not interesting gameplay. We have larger set of promising changes in progress for her that fixes her long range spear problems while trying to emphasize more of her "hunting" ideas (you'll hear about it when we get more confidence in the overall direction), but we may need to make a power adjustment on the interim if Nidalee remains so optimal for poke comps.

8) AD Carries

Twitch has made a big splash recently in the competitive scene. Some of our design team has wondered why it did not happen earlier, given his strong laning and fantastic end-game scaling. We're guessing his prettier (or uglier, depending on the thematic we're going for) model helps. We're not going to rush any changes on him yet since we'd like some time to see how a high pick rate on him will play out, but he's definitely on our radar. His end-game hypercarry role is something we like and are unlikely to remove from the game; if anything, his early Contaminate (formerly Expunge) damage may be a little too powerful.

Lucian has been a steady pick in competitive for some time now. His combination of very reliable and effective damage in lane (his Piercing Light ability has relatively low counterplay and Lightslinger is a strong scaling damage passive), as well as his very high levels of safety make him a carry with virtually no weaknesses. We are a little more confident that we're going to need to make adjustments to him soon to help give him more defined strengths and weaknesses instead of being such a generalist blind pick.

9) Jungle

We have been spending a lot of time examining what function the jungle plays in League of Legends and how to evaluate jungler interactions we like seeing in the game. We need more time to deliver a cohesive story here but I want to note that it is at the front and center of our team's focus right now.

10) Braum

Braum has just released and we are keeping a close eye on his power level!

Lifetime RP Purchase Rewards To Be Revealed This Year

Originally Posted by Riot (View Original Source)

What happened to the lifetime purchase RP rewards?

::wisps of air spiral out from Thresh’s lantern and an apparition appears resembling DontHassleDaHoff::

“You summoned me, your grace” – ‘daHoff says.

“Where are our Lifetime purchase RP rewards?” The Player asks.

::The apparition twists unto itself, contorts into Baron Nashor, then shifts into Draaaaaaven, then morphs into Braum. Unable to find a stable shape, the apparition, concedes to the form of ambiguity, taking the shape that The Player wants, before shifting to the next form.::

“The Player has spoken, it has many voices. We’ve asked many of you and the feelings around this program causes much contention. One issue that we’re concerned with is the treatment of players that spend money differently than those that don't. Another is that the rewards are achievable without spending too much money. Another is that the rewards are valuable enough to feel good to those that receive them, without feeling too bad to those that don't. Most of the ideas we've come up with solve one or more of these concerns but not the rest.

“I'm promised Hippalus that these problems will all be solved by the end of 2014 and the Player will be happy. We value all of our Players, and we’re keeping that in mind in our design of the program. Hopefully The Player likes it as well.”

::With his last words, DontHassleDaHoff, stares at the player with a look of hope, seeking approval, but expecting the worst.::

4.8 Team Builder Bugs and Feedback

Originally Posted by Riot (View Original Source)

Hey all you PBE Team Builders,

For 4.8 we have a couple of updates for Team Builder that need some PBE testing. Check these out and post a comment here if you spot any bugs. Be sure to post reproduction steps so we can check it out and narrow down the cause of any bugs.

  1. The unranked "Classic 5v5" Wins counter in your Summoner Profile should now include all the wins you've accrued using Team Builder.

  2. Captains can now grant invite privileges to buddies they invite to Team Builder (just like in normal pre-champ-select lobbies)

We have some more improvements we're working on for 4.8 and I'll update this thread when they are available for testing.



EDIT: Team Builder is available from 1-5pm PST on Monday/Wednesday and from 6am-10am PST on Tuesday/Thursday.

Pixel Poro Minigame - Featuring Braum - Out Today!

Originally Posted by Riot (View RedTracker Source)

Braum’s epic shield may look strong enough to stop an avalanche crashing down the side of one of Freljord’s peaks, but that doesn’t mean it can’t be used for a much more whimsical past-time.

Pixel Poro, a new browser minigame (compatible with IOS and Android browsers), finds the upcoming addition to the League of Legends champion roster battling Leona for support supremacy. Volley an adorable poro back and forth between snowy cliffs, trying to knock him past your opponent to score points. You can either play by yourself or locally with a friend. First champion to score 10 points wins the match - and the poro’s undying love.

We hope you enjoy Braum and Leona’s pixel makeovers. Keep that shield up!

Click here to play!



  • #32 Xitli

    People have played Kog'maw a bit in the OGN recently. I would put him down as "mediocre" but Ashe I agree is in a really bad spot. Could be part of the larger problem that CC doesn't seem to be valued very highly in S4.

    Lucian is just overall too strong (competitively) - I expect he needs some minor nerfs along with Twitch, even if they slightly buff some of the other ADCs. Solo queue I don't think it's as big of a deal, but I think Twitch is going to become more and more dominant for the pros.

  • #33 WithoutQuestion

    Ashe more suffers because she has no steroid, no escape, and no scaling features to her kit at all. Her ult is still good, but the rest of her kit is just really meh. Her Q and E are just really terrible.

  • #41 Arselum

    Urgot didn't even appear there, poor guy.

  • #42 WithoutQuestion

    He's more of some sort of awkward fighter then a marksman.

  • #79 klocugh12

    Sivir barely picked, while Ez picked a lot?

    You obviously watch different games than I do...

    Kog'maw and Ashe are NEVER gonna become priority picks again outside of highly coordinated protect comps. They have obvious strengths and obvious weaknesses, and the latter is decisive for their popularity.

    Ashe had a little resurgence due to Heartseeker skin a while ago, but that's about as much as these are gonna get.

    Last edited by klocugh12: 5/14/2014 1:34:24 PM
  • #105 smedium

    Wow. People do forget that Quinn exists.

  • #25 SixTango

    I believe they should stop nerfing adcs and start buffing some of the others. Look at the state of sivir now. She was popular after the rework and buffs, and then they nerfed her and we rarely see her again. Lucian is in a good place because I feel his late game isn't the best, but his mid and early are good. I wish riot would take a look at adcs that aren't getting picked and figure out why. Then make adjustments to those champions and not the ones that are getting picked. The Marksman class in general is getting weaker because whenever a adc gets strong or picked they get nerfed. I think eventually the Adc will be a support role and the support will be the new bot lane carry.

  • #37 WithoutQuestion

    Sivir was popular because she was INSANE. Her Q double proc was enough to push people out of lane and her ult just made her more useful then everyone else.

    Lucian is in a terrible place and is ridiculously overpowered. He trades way too well in lane. Scales hard because of his passive. Is safe with MS steroid and a Dash that Removes Slows. And he has high AD scaling skills.

    The marksman class is getting weaker because the game has shifted into Early game dominance, from when it used to be Farm till late. When CLG split push was popular and games would last 50+ minutes Vayne and Kog'Maw were gods. Now Early game is everything and any ADC that can just remove you from your lane is going to be good.

    Also, bruisers are much stronger then they were before and can easily duel ADC's at most points in the game unless they have a strong lead.

  • #48 SixTango

    So because the meta has shifted you should nerf the adc's that are strong in it? All I'm saying is if you keep nerfing adc's they will keep getting weaker and it will no longer be a carry role. If you nerf lucian and twitch you will default back to Cait and crush every other adc. Vayne, Kog, Trist, and Jinx all have a stronger late game than Lucian. Just like Vayne and Kog shined during their meta. I believe Lucian and Twitch should shine in theirs. Instead of having all weak adc's. The game has shifted into Early game dominance is what you said. Which is why he is strong. I just don't like how riot keeps nerfing champs until they aren't played anymore. Buff the weak and keep the strong.

  • #53 WithoutQuestion

    Yes. Lucian is WAY too strong right now. So ridiculously strong that he outshines every other adc by miles. Twitch and Cait are the alternatives, Corki is the only other kind of strong one right now.

    Also, Lucian has already been shining, for the past few months. Look at all the tournament games for S4, they have been dominated by Lucian as the main ADC nothing else (besides maybe Cait?), has really even poked their head out, except for twitch now.

    All ADC's are going to be weak while the meta is early game because ADC's are not designed for early game, their only use right now is to push towers and they need sustain + damage (hence the BT/Triforce rushes). ADC's are intended to push towers, and to deal consistent heavy damage in teamfights, which is what they do. Except for that in S4 the meta is to push objectives fast and overwhelm your enemies. ADC's need items to get strong, Lucian does not need much to reach his power spike compared to other ADC's who heavily rely on Crit or ATKSPD.

    Lucian is the only marksman with a steroid from Lv.1 (his passive) that gets better every level with no drawback. He never really hits a Ceiling with his power and gets his spike way too early.

    There aren't that many cases where Riot nerfs champions until they aren't played anymore recently. Lulu was nerfed pretty hard and is still playable. Syndra is still dominant. Sivir is Okay. Annie is Okay. Kha'zix is strong.  Kayle, Evelynn, Jinx are all Okay as well.

  • #54 Yaamahri

    Nah. ADC's are the most binary role in the game. Deserve to go poof.

  • #91 acheron16

    I gotta agree with the other guy.

    Its getting to the point where "support mages" (mid champs that currently suck too much to play at mid) and supports in general do more damage than ADC's until late game.

    I'm no expert, but that just seems wrong to me

  • #40 n4zArh

    Sivir had like 60-70% winrate through all leagues, bronze-diamond. That's reason why she was nerfed.

  • #50 SixTango

    Nerfed to the point she isn't played anymore. Riot comes out with a patch about every week. They also have PBE for testing. If someone is overpower fine, but don't nerf a champ into the ground. Small tweaks here and there are fine, but think about how long Sivir didn't see any play compared to the little shine that she got.

  • #57 WithoutQuestion

    She wasn't even nerfed that hard they just didn't want her Boomerang blade basically 100-0'ing people at lv.1. Which is what it was doing basically. They shifted all of her power into mid game by changing the mechanics of the Q and her passive scaling.

    The only thing that was really over the top was reducing her E duration by half which really messed her up :/. But was also really overpowered in the first place. 3 Seconds of immunity from the first spell coming at you.

  • #92 acheron16

    If only her boomerang wasn't a skill shot and required two clean passes at the target alone to deal said damage.

    Oh wait...

  • #106 Rahvin90210

    But in fairness, her spell shield isn't meant to be similar to Morgana's shield, it's meant to reward good timing and reactions, which is why it has such a short cooldown now.

  • #23 ShockOne

    You can add me to the voices calling for other adc to be buffed, rather than Lucian be nerfed. 

  • #22 Thunderlinth

    gj riot. one champ becomes popular like twitch and all we think about is the nerfhammer, meanwhile toxic champions like caitlyn were played for so many months that i lost counting and were untouched.


  • #16 TehUnacceptable

    What is the life time RP rewards?

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